Would a Fireball cast by a Pixie/Human/Dragon of the same level have the same power?

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In essence this relates to weapon damage from creatures using "identical" weapons: A human's long sword does 1d8 damage, sure, but a storm giant with a proportionally sized long sword shouldn't do merely 1d8 damage plus its strength bonus simply because it's described/shaped like a long sword.



So a pixie is Tiny while a human is Medium and a dragon is Gargantuan in size. In a scenario where you have all three lined up at a target range and they're all, say, 10th level casters, would the size and effect of their fireballs be identical in scope?



A pixie is a little, itty bitty creature. For it to cast fireball and for it to equal the size and destructive ability of a human caster's fireball would seem overpowered.



Likewise a dragon is a mammoth creature so if it cast fireball you'd expect the magic it channeled to be much greater than a standard human caster's fireball.










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  • 15




    Judge me by my size, do you?
    – Rubiksmoose
    Aug 13 at 12:08
















up vote
11
down vote

favorite
1












In essence this relates to weapon damage from creatures using "identical" weapons: A human's long sword does 1d8 damage, sure, but a storm giant with a proportionally sized long sword shouldn't do merely 1d8 damage plus its strength bonus simply because it's described/shaped like a long sword.



So a pixie is Tiny while a human is Medium and a dragon is Gargantuan in size. In a scenario where you have all three lined up at a target range and they're all, say, 10th level casters, would the size and effect of their fireballs be identical in scope?



A pixie is a little, itty bitty creature. For it to cast fireball and for it to equal the size and destructive ability of a human caster's fireball would seem overpowered.



Likewise a dragon is a mammoth creature so if it cast fireball you'd expect the magic it channeled to be much greater than a standard human caster's fireball.










share|improve this question



















  • 15




    Judge me by my size, do you?
    – Rubiksmoose
    Aug 13 at 12:08












up vote
11
down vote

favorite
1









up vote
11
down vote

favorite
1






1





In essence this relates to weapon damage from creatures using "identical" weapons: A human's long sword does 1d8 damage, sure, but a storm giant with a proportionally sized long sword shouldn't do merely 1d8 damage plus its strength bonus simply because it's described/shaped like a long sword.



So a pixie is Tiny while a human is Medium and a dragon is Gargantuan in size. In a scenario where you have all three lined up at a target range and they're all, say, 10th level casters, would the size and effect of their fireballs be identical in scope?



A pixie is a little, itty bitty creature. For it to cast fireball and for it to equal the size and destructive ability of a human caster's fireball would seem overpowered.



Likewise a dragon is a mammoth creature so if it cast fireball you'd expect the magic it channeled to be much greater than a standard human caster's fireball.










share|improve this question















In essence this relates to weapon damage from creatures using "identical" weapons: A human's long sword does 1d8 damage, sure, but a storm giant with a proportionally sized long sword shouldn't do merely 1d8 damage plus its strength bonus simply because it's described/shaped like a long sword.



So a pixie is Tiny while a human is Medium and a dragon is Gargantuan in size. In a scenario where you have all three lined up at a target range and they're all, say, 10th level casters, would the size and effect of their fireballs be identical in scope?



A pixie is a little, itty bitty creature. For it to cast fireball and for it to equal the size and destructive ability of a human caster's fireball would seem overpowered.



Likewise a dragon is a mammoth creature so if it cast fireball you'd expect the magic it channeled to be much greater than a standard human caster's fireball.







dnd-5e spells creature-size area-of-effect






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edited Aug 14 at 8:49









Christopher

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asked Aug 13 at 11:30









Basement Cat

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  • 15




    Judge me by my size, do you?
    – Rubiksmoose
    Aug 13 at 12:08












  • 15




    Judge me by my size, do you?
    – Rubiksmoose
    Aug 13 at 12:08







15




15




Judge me by my size, do you?
– Rubiksmoose
Aug 13 at 12:08




Judge me by my size, do you?
– Rubiksmoose
Aug 13 at 12:08










4 Answers
4






active

oldest

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up vote
41
down vote



accepted










Magic is unaffected by creature size. Creatures can have benefits for particular types of magic (it’s easy to imagine a dragon getting bonuses on fireball—after all, their descendants do—or a pixie getting some benefit with illusions), but nothing automatic just for being larger. Any such benefit would be listed directly in the creature entry.



For reference, this is also consistent with previous editions of Dungeons & Dragons. The premise, presumably, is that magic cannot be judged on physical grounds, and it’s in magic’s very nature to surprise you.






share|improve this answer


















  • 1




    This is also intuitive, when viewed through the right lens. The pixie is clearly a far superior caster to a human barbarian, despite being significantly smaller.
    – Mooing Duck
    Aug 14 at 0:15

















up vote
31
down vote













They would be equally powerful, as magic effects aren't affected by caster size, only by spell level. The description of fireball says:




Each creature in a 20-foot-radius sphere centered on that point must make a Dexterity saving throw. A target takes 8d6 fire damage on a failed save, or half as much damage on a successful one.



[. . .]



At Higher Levels. When you cast this spell using a spell slot of 4th level or higher, the damage increases by 1d6 for each slot level above 3rd.




As you can see, there is nothing in the description that says that damage is affected in any way by the caster's size, only by the level of the spell slot that they are using to cast.






share|improve this answer





























    up vote
    17
    down vote













    Spells only do what they say - if they don't say they change based on the caster's size, they don't change



    Magic isn't like a sword or other physical object. It has its own rules, and part of the appeal of magic in the first place is that it allows a lowly human being to achieve things comparable to dragons and other mighty creatures. In general, how big you are has no effect on the power of the magic you can wield - that's a function purely of your own magical skill and talent, as represented by your character/caster level (and so the level of spell slots you have available) and your spellcasting ability score.



    Unless the spell says that its effects vary based on the caster's size, it will have the same effect for a caster of any size.






    share|improve this answer





























      up vote
      5
      down vote













      Maybe not "the same," but not because of creature size



      There are many different kinds of magic in the world of DnD: divine, arcane, psionic, innate, etc. But when it comes to a creature's spellcasting (when not done through a magical item or other external means), there's a common theme: a spell's power and precision are bolstered by the heart and mind, not the body.



      Every creature in the Monster Manual, and class or race in the Player's Handbook that can cast spells does so with a spellcasting ability of Charisma, Wisdom, or Intelligence. None of these are Abilities which are guaranteed to increase with size (a Tarrasque has between a +0 and a -4 in each of them). But they do tend to vary from one creature to another. Some dragons are far more charismatic than others by default (Gold dragons especially), and pixies tend to be more intelligent than white dragons, as a rule.



      Likewise, a creature's proficiency bonus, which is essential in determining both its spell save DC and its spell attack modifier, does not necessarily correspond perfectly with its class level. For example, a Drow Mage (MM p. 129) is a "10th-level spellcaster," but seems to have a proficiency bonus of +3. A 10th level adventurer (player character) would have a proficiency bonus of +4. Proficiency bonus is also not reliably related to size: an Awakened Tree is a Huge creature, but only has a proficiency bonus of +2 (MM, p. 317).



      All of this means that a spell may be "more" or "less" powerful when it is cast by two different creatures, even if they have the same spellcaster class and level: but only because the saving throws will be more difficult to pass, or the spell will be more likely to hit. And these differences will not be directly related to the size of the creature casting the spell.






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        4 Answers
        4






        active

        oldest

        votes








        4 Answers
        4






        active

        oldest

        votes









        active

        oldest

        votes






        active

        oldest

        votes








        up vote
        41
        down vote



        accepted










        Magic is unaffected by creature size. Creatures can have benefits for particular types of magic (it’s easy to imagine a dragon getting bonuses on fireball—after all, their descendants do—or a pixie getting some benefit with illusions), but nothing automatic just for being larger. Any such benefit would be listed directly in the creature entry.



        For reference, this is also consistent with previous editions of Dungeons & Dragons. The premise, presumably, is that magic cannot be judged on physical grounds, and it’s in magic’s very nature to surprise you.






        share|improve this answer


















        • 1




          This is also intuitive, when viewed through the right lens. The pixie is clearly a far superior caster to a human barbarian, despite being significantly smaller.
          – Mooing Duck
          Aug 14 at 0:15














        up vote
        41
        down vote



        accepted










        Magic is unaffected by creature size. Creatures can have benefits for particular types of magic (it’s easy to imagine a dragon getting bonuses on fireball—after all, their descendants do—or a pixie getting some benefit with illusions), but nothing automatic just for being larger. Any such benefit would be listed directly in the creature entry.



        For reference, this is also consistent with previous editions of Dungeons & Dragons. The premise, presumably, is that magic cannot be judged on physical grounds, and it’s in magic’s very nature to surprise you.






        share|improve this answer


















        • 1




          This is also intuitive, when viewed through the right lens. The pixie is clearly a far superior caster to a human barbarian, despite being significantly smaller.
          – Mooing Duck
          Aug 14 at 0:15












        up vote
        41
        down vote



        accepted







        up vote
        41
        down vote



        accepted






        Magic is unaffected by creature size. Creatures can have benefits for particular types of magic (it’s easy to imagine a dragon getting bonuses on fireball—after all, their descendants do—or a pixie getting some benefit with illusions), but nothing automatic just for being larger. Any such benefit would be listed directly in the creature entry.



        For reference, this is also consistent with previous editions of Dungeons & Dragons. The premise, presumably, is that magic cannot be judged on physical grounds, and it’s in magic’s very nature to surprise you.






        share|improve this answer














        Magic is unaffected by creature size. Creatures can have benefits for particular types of magic (it’s easy to imagine a dragon getting bonuses on fireball—after all, their descendants do—or a pixie getting some benefit with illusions), but nothing automatic just for being larger. Any such benefit would be listed directly in the creature entry.



        For reference, this is also consistent with previous editions of Dungeons & Dragons. The premise, presumably, is that magic cannot be judged on physical grounds, and it’s in magic’s very nature to surprise you.







        share|improve this answer














        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer








        edited Aug 13 at 11:48

























        answered Aug 13 at 11:44









        KRyan

        206k23508894




        206k23508894







        • 1




          This is also intuitive, when viewed through the right lens. The pixie is clearly a far superior caster to a human barbarian, despite being significantly smaller.
          – Mooing Duck
          Aug 14 at 0:15












        • 1




          This is also intuitive, when viewed through the right lens. The pixie is clearly a far superior caster to a human barbarian, despite being significantly smaller.
          – Mooing Duck
          Aug 14 at 0:15







        1




        1




        This is also intuitive, when viewed through the right lens. The pixie is clearly a far superior caster to a human barbarian, despite being significantly smaller.
        – Mooing Duck
        Aug 14 at 0:15




        This is also intuitive, when viewed through the right lens. The pixie is clearly a far superior caster to a human barbarian, despite being significantly smaller.
        – Mooing Duck
        Aug 14 at 0:15












        up vote
        31
        down vote













        They would be equally powerful, as magic effects aren't affected by caster size, only by spell level. The description of fireball says:




        Each creature in a 20-foot-radius sphere centered on that point must make a Dexterity saving throw. A target takes 8d6 fire damage on a failed save, or half as much damage on a successful one.



        [. . .]



        At Higher Levels. When you cast this spell using a spell slot of 4th level or higher, the damage increases by 1d6 for each slot level above 3rd.




        As you can see, there is nothing in the description that says that damage is affected in any way by the caster's size, only by the level of the spell slot that they are using to cast.






        share|improve this answer


























          up vote
          31
          down vote













          They would be equally powerful, as magic effects aren't affected by caster size, only by spell level. The description of fireball says:




          Each creature in a 20-foot-radius sphere centered on that point must make a Dexterity saving throw. A target takes 8d6 fire damage on a failed save, or half as much damage on a successful one.



          [. . .]



          At Higher Levels. When you cast this spell using a spell slot of 4th level or higher, the damage increases by 1d6 for each slot level above 3rd.




          As you can see, there is nothing in the description that says that damage is affected in any way by the caster's size, only by the level of the spell slot that they are using to cast.






          share|improve this answer
























            up vote
            31
            down vote










            up vote
            31
            down vote









            They would be equally powerful, as magic effects aren't affected by caster size, only by spell level. The description of fireball says:




            Each creature in a 20-foot-radius sphere centered on that point must make a Dexterity saving throw. A target takes 8d6 fire damage on a failed save, or half as much damage on a successful one.



            [. . .]



            At Higher Levels. When you cast this spell using a spell slot of 4th level or higher, the damage increases by 1d6 for each slot level above 3rd.




            As you can see, there is nothing in the description that says that damage is affected in any way by the caster's size, only by the level of the spell slot that they are using to cast.






            share|improve this answer














            They would be equally powerful, as magic effects aren't affected by caster size, only by spell level. The description of fireball says:




            Each creature in a 20-foot-radius sphere centered on that point must make a Dexterity saving throw. A target takes 8d6 fire damage on a failed save, or half as much damage on a successful one.



            [. . .]



            At Higher Levels. When you cast this spell using a spell slot of 4th level or higher, the damage increases by 1d6 for each slot level above 3rd.




            As you can see, there is nothing in the description that says that damage is affected in any way by the caster's size, only by the level of the spell slot that they are using to cast.







            share|improve this answer














            share|improve this answer



            share|improve this answer








            edited Aug 13 at 12:09

























            answered Aug 13 at 11:48









            Mr. Sandman

            1,201617




            1,201617




















                up vote
                17
                down vote













                Spells only do what they say - if they don't say they change based on the caster's size, they don't change



                Magic isn't like a sword or other physical object. It has its own rules, and part of the appeal of magic in the first place is that it allows a lowly human being to achieve things comparable to dragons and other mighty creatures. In general, how big you are has no effect on the power of the magic you can wield - that's a function purely of your own magical skill and talent, as represented by your character/caster level (and so the level of spell slots you have available) and your spellcasting ability score.



                Unless the spell says that its effects vary based on the caster's size, it will have the same effect for a caster of any size.






                share|improve this answer


























                  up vote
                  17
                  down vote













                  Spells only do what they say - if they don't say they change based on the caster's size, they don't change



                  Magic isn't like a sword or other physical object. It has its own rules, and part of the appeal of magic in the first place is that it allows a lowly human being to achieve things comparable to dragons and other mighty creatures. In general, how big you are has no effect on the power of the magic you can wield - that's a function purely of your own magical skill and talent, as represented by your character/caster level (and so the level of spell slots you have available) and your spellcasting ability score.



                  Unless the spell says that its effects vary based on the caster's size, it will have the same effect for a caster of any size.






                  share|improve this answer
























                    up vote
                    17
                    down vote










                    up vote
                    17
                    down vote









                    Spells only do what they say - if they don't say they change based on the caster's size, they don't change



                    Magic isn't like a sword or other physical object. It has its own rules, and part of the appeal of magic in the first place is that it allows a lowly human being to achieve things comparable to dragons and other mighty creatures. In general, how big you are has no effect on the power of the magic you can wield - that's a function purely of your own magical skill and talent, as represented by your character/caster level (and so the level of spell slots you have available) and your spellcasting ability score.



                    Unless the spell says that its effects vary based on the caster's size, it will have the same effect for a caster of any size.






                    share|improve this answer














                    Spells only do what they say - if they don't say they change based on the caster's size, they don't change



                    Magic isn't like a sword or other physical object. It has its own rules, and part of the appeal of magic in the first place is that it allows a lowly human being to achieve things comparable to dragons and other mighty creatures. In general, how big you are has no effect on the power of the magic you can wield - that's a function purely of your own magical skill and talent, as represented by your character/caster level (and so the level of spell slots you have available) and your spellcasting ability score.



                    Unless the spell says that its effects vary based on the caster's size, it will have the same effect for a caster of any size.







                    share|improve this answer














                    share|improve this answer



                    share|improve this answer








                    edited Aug 13 at 12:06

























                    answered Aug 13 at 11:49









                    Carcer

                    18.5k247103




                    18.5k247103




















                        up vote
                        5
                        down vote













                        Maybe not "the same," but not because of creature size



                        There are many different kinds of magic in the world of DnD: divine, arcane, psionic, innate, etc. But when it comes to a creature's spellcasting (when not done through a magical item or other external means), there's a common theme: a spell's power and precision are bolstered by the heart and mind, not the body.



                        Every creature in the Monster Manual, and class or race in the Player's Handbook that can cast spells does so with a spellcasting ability of Charisma, Wisdom, or Intelligence. None of these are Abilities which are guaranteed to increase with size (a Tarrasque has between a +0 and a -4 in each of them). But they do tend to vary from one creature to another. Some dragons are far more charismatic than others by default (Gold dragons especially), and pixies tend to be more intelligent than white dragons, as a rule.



                        Likewise, a creature's proficiency bonus, which is essential in determining both its spell save DC and its spell attack modifier, does not necessarily correspond perfectly with its class level. For example, a Drow Mage (MM p. 129) is a "10th-level spellcaster," but seems to have a proficiency bonus of +3. A 10th level adventurer (player character) would have a proficiency bonus of +4. Proficiency bonus is also not reliably related to size: an Awakened Tree is a Huge creature, but only has a proficiency bonus of +2 (MM, p. 317).



                        All of this means that a spell may be "more" or "less" powerful when it is cast by two different creatures, even if they have the same spellcaster class and level: but only because the saving throws will be more difficult to pass, or the spell will be more likely to hit. And these differences will not be directly related to the size of the creature casting the spell.






                        share|improve this answer
























                          up vote
                          5
                          down vote













                          Maybe not "the same," but not because of creature size



                          There are many different kinds of magic in the world of DnD: divine, arcane, psionic, innate, etc. But when it comes to a creature's spellcasting (when not done through a magical item or other external means), there's a common theme: a spell's power and precision are bolstered by the heart and mind, not the body.



                          Every creature in the Monster Manual, and class or race in the Player's Handbook that can cast spells does so with a spellcasting ability of Charisma, Wisdom, or Intelligence. None of these are Abilities which are guaranteed to increase with size (a Tarrasque has between a +0 and a -4 in each of them). But they do tend to vary from one creature to another. Some dragons are far more charismatic than others by default (Gold dragons especially), and pixies tend to be more intelligent than white dragons, as a rule.



                          Likewise, a creature's proficiency bonus, which is essential in determining both its spell save DC and its spell attack modifier, does not necessarily correspond perfectly with its class level. For example, a Drow Mage (MM p. 129) is a "10th-level spellcaster," but seems to have a proficiency bonus of +3. A 10th level adventurer (player character) would have a proficiency bonus of +4. Proficiency bonus is also not reliably related to size: an Awakened Tree is a Huge creature, but only has a proficiency bonus of +2 (MM, p. 317).



                          All of this means that a spell may be "more" or "less" powerful when it is cast by two different creatures, even if they have the same spellcaster class and level: but only because the saving throws will be more difficult to pass, or the spell will be more likely to hit. And these differences will not be directly related to the size of the creature casting the spell.






                          share|improve this answer






















                            up vote
                            5
                            down vote










                            up vote
                            5
                            down vote









                            Maybe not "the same," but not because of creature size



                            There are many different kinds of magic in the world of DnD: divine, arcane, psionic, innate, etc. But when it comes to a creature's spellcasting (when not done through a magical item or other external means), there's a common theme: a spell's power and precision are bolstered by the heart and mind, not the body.



                            Every creature in the Monster Manual, and class or race in the Player's Handbook that can cast spells does so with a spellcasting ability of Charisma, Wisdom, or Intelligence. None of these are Abilities which are guaranteed to increase with size (a Tarrasque has between a +0 and a -4 in each of them). But they do tend to vary from one creature to another. Some dragons are far more charismatic than others by default (Gold dragons especially), and pixies tend to be more intelligent than white dragons, as a rule.



                            Likewise, a creature's proficiency bonus, which is essential in determining both its spell save DC and its spell attack modifier, does not necessarily correspond perfectly with its class level. For example, a Drow Mage (MM p. 129) is a "10th-level spellcaster," but seems to have a proficiency bonus of +3. A 10th level adventurer (player character) would have a proficiency bonus of +4. Proficiency bonus is also not reliably related to size: an Awakened Tree is a Huge creature, but only has a proficiency bonus of +2 (MM, p. 317).



                            All of this means that a spell may be "more" or "less" powerful when it is cast by two different creatures, even if they have the same spellcaster class and level: but only because the saving throws will be more difficult to pass, or the spell will be more likely to hit. And these differences will not be directly related to the size of the creature casting the spell.






                            share|improve this answer












                            Maybe not "the same," but not because of creature size



                            There are many different kinds of magic in the world of DnD: divine, arcane, psionic, innate, etc. But when it comes to a creature's spellcasting (when not done through a magical item or other external means), there's a common theme: a spell's power and precision are bolstered by the heart and mind, not the body.



                            Every creature in the Monster Manual, and class or race in the Player's Handbook that can cast spells does so with a spellcasting ability of Charisma, Wisdom, or Intelligence. None of these are Abilities which are guaranteed to increase with size (a Tarrasque has between a +0 and a -4 in each of them). But they do tend to vary from one creature to another. Some dragons are far more charismatic than others by default (Gold dragons especially), and pixies tend to be more intelligent than white dragons, as a rule.



                            Likewise, a creature's proficiency bonus, which is essential in determining both its spell save DC and its spell attack modifier, does not necessarily correspond perfectly with its class level. For example, a Drow Mage (MM p. 129) is a "10th-level spellcaster," but seems to have a proficiency bonus of +3. A 10th level adventurer (player character) would have a proficiency bonus of +4. Proficiency bonus is also not reliably related to size: an Awakened Tree is a Huge creature, but only has a proficiency bonus of +2 (MM, p. 317).



                            All of this means that a spell may be "more" or "less" powerful when it is cast by two different creatures, even if they have the same spellcaster class and level: but only because the saving throws will be more difficult to pass, or the spell will be more likely to hit. And these differences will not be directly related to the size of the creature casting the spell.







                            share|improve this answer












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                            answered Aug 13 at 17:49









                            Gandalfmeansme

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