How to communicate to my mother that I find it hurtful when she cooks dessert for everyone except me who is vegan?
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TL;DR
When my mom bakes a cake for us (whoever is at home but it's usually me, my little sister, my father and her), she uses eggs (which are not vegan), even if I will be there. How can I tell her that I find it hurtful to completely ignore the fact that I'm vegan, and thus can't eat the dessert?
Background
I'm 23, I have been vegan for 2 years, I live in my parents' house (well, not the past 6 months but I'm moving in again). I often cook the meal or part of it.
My mom hates cooking (I hate it too). She also doesn't like that I'm vegan and would probably wish for me to "convert back".
For the meal, there isn't a "main dish", there is just vegetables and starchy cook separately from the meat to make the meal vegan for me.
If she cooks something that needs milk/butter, she uses vegan alternatives but, if she needs eggs, she won't use the vegan alternative.
What I have tried
When I see that she is about to prepare a (non-vegan) cake, I ask her, why not use some maize starch(or some compote, depending) instead but she always told me "that's not how I learned to cook" or some similar excuse.
Sometimes, she will also say: if you aren't happy, you can cook. But the problem is, I do cook sometimes (just not cake) and I don't want to always have to do the cooking just because I'm the only vegan at home. Even though I know what to use as an alternative and would be able to tell her.
I didn't tell her (yet) that I found her hurtful because I wanted to avoid this (probably) difficult conversation.
Question
How can I communicate to my mother that I find it hurtful when she cooks for everyone but me?
Notes and clarifications
My mother does cook vegan stuff sometimes but only if she only needs to switch cow milk with rice milk. If it involves eggs, she won't switch ingredients.
When there are multiple things to eat, I don't really mind not eating something but when there is only one dessert, I do mind. Especially since this happens on a regular base (~ once per week).
Please, don't tell me that I'm selfish. I just want to be able to enjoy a vegan cake the same way they enjoy the vegan meals that I make.
No, I can't go out and buy a vegan cake, they're not readily available where I live.
A lot of answers suggest to teach her to cook vegan. This might work, but it might also not work: last time I tried, she just let me do the waffles on my own. So, I would be grateful for other solutions that do not involve cooking.
If the dessert is vegan, everyone will happily eat it.
My mother usually cooks 2/4 of time, me 1/4 and my father 1/4. At least that's how I see things but everyone on the house probably has a different opinion on the matter.
The cake is usually for the four of us (well, three of them since I can't eat it). If it's for guests, I mind less not being able to eat it (because it's not really for me, because I usually know in advance and because I can prepare/buy myself something else if needed).
Some people seem to think that I'm vegan for health reason, I'm really, really not. And the last time I tried to eat a not vegan cake, I didn't enjoy it because I felt guilty.
Follow up
I have asked my mother to tell me every time she wants to use eggs in a recipe (so that I can jump in and use something else instead).
I also printed and pinned on the fridge a summary table of what to use instead of eggs.
Finally, today, when my mother told me she wanted to make a pie using eggs, I jumped in and used Maizena instead (will she was cooking some other stuff). We didn't cook together but she mostly saw what I did and I hope that, if I do it often enough, she will start doing it by herself.
(but answers to help bring that issue with her are still very welcome if all this doesn't work)
Notes and clarification:
I would rather have the answer to "How to communicate to my mother that I find it hurtful when..." but people keep giving me answers to "how to have her cook vegan" so I used their solution in the hope that I won't need to "communicate that I find it hurtful when..."
family conflicts parents france eating
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up vote
26
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TL;DR
When my mom bakes a cake for us (whoever is at home but it's usually me, my little sister, my father and her), she uses eggs (which are not vegan), even if I will be there. How can I tell her that I find it hurtful to completely ignore the fact that I'm vegan, and thus can't eat the dessert?
Background
I'm 23, I have been vegan for 2 years, I live in my parents' house (well, not the past 6 months but I'm moving in again). I often cook the meal or part of it.
My mom hates cooking (I hate it too). She also doesn't like that I'm vegan and would probably wish for me to "convert back".
For the meal, there isn't a "main dish", there is just vegetables and starchy cook separately from the meat to make the meal vegan for me.
If she cooks something that needs milk/butter, she uses vegan alternatives but, if she needs eggs, she won't use the vegan alternative.
What I have tried
When I see that she is about to prepare a (non-vegan) cake, I ask her, why not use some maize starch(or some compote, depending) instead but she always told me "that's not how I learned to cook" or some similar excuse.
Sometimes, she will also say: if you aren't happy, you can cook. But the problem is, I do cook sometimes (just not cake) and I don't want to always have to do the cooking just because I'm the only vegan at home. Even though I know what to use as an alternative and would be able to tell her.
I didn't tell her (yet) that I found her hurtful because I wanted to avoid this (probably) difficult conversation.
Question
How can I communicate to my mother that I find it hurtful when she cooks for everyone but me?
Notes and clarifications
My mother does cook vegan stuff sometimes but only if she only needs to switch cow milk with rice milk. If it involves eggs, she won't switch ingredients.
When there are multiple things to eat, I don't really mind not eating something but when there is only one dessert, I do mind. Especially since this happens on a regular base (~ once per week).
Please, don't tell me that I'm selfish. I just want to be able to enjoy a vegan cake the same way they enjoy the vegan meals that I make.
No, I can't go out and buy a vegan cake, they're not readily available where I live.
A lot of answers suggest to teach her to cook vegan. This might work, but it might also not work: last time I tried, she just let me do the waffles on my own. So, I would be grateful for other solutions that do not involve cooking.
If the dessert is vegan, everyone will happily eat it.
My mother usually cooks 2/4 of time, me 1/4 and my father 1/4. At least that's how I see things but everyone on the house probably has a different opinion on the matter.
The cake is usually for the four of us (well, three of them since I can't eat it). If it's for guests, I mind less not being able to eat it (because it's not really for me, because I usually know in advance and because I can prepare/buy myself something else if needed).
Some people seem to think that I'm vegan for health reason, I'm really, really not. And the last time I tried to eat a not vegan cake, I didn't enjoy it because I felt guilty.
Follow up
I have asked my mother to tell me every time she wants to use eggs in a recipe (so that I can jump in and use something else instead).
I also printed and pinned on the fridge a summary table of what to use instead of eggs.
Finally, today, when my mother told me she wanted to make a pie using eggs, I jumped in and used Maizena instead (will she was cooking some other stuff). We didn't cook together but she mostly saw what I did and I hope that, if I do it often enough, she will start doing it by herself.
(but answers to help bring that issue with her are still very welcome if all this doesn't work)
Notes and clarification:
I would rather have the answer to "How to communicate to my mother that I find it hurtful when..." but people keep giving me answers to "how to have her cook vegan" so I used their solution in the hope that I won't need to "communicate that I find it hurtful when..."
family conflicts parents france eating
2
Please donâÂÂt write answers in comments. It bypasses our quality measures by not having voting (both up and down) available on comments, as well as having other problems detailed on meta. Comments are for clarifying and improving the question; please donâÂÂt use them for other purposes.
â Tinkeringbellâ¦
Oct 1 at 11:17
1
You assume that your mother cooks for you four, but you can't eat it. Does your mother thinks, she cooks for all the family or her position is more like "i cook, what i like. I'm fine with everybody eating, what i cooked"?
â fixerlt
Oct 2 at 12:03
1
@fixerlt She does cook what she likes but she always takes care of doing enough for everyone so, ...
â Noon
Oct 2 at 12:10
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up vote
26
down vote
favorite
up vote
26
down vote
favorite
TL;DR
When my mom bakes a cake for us (whoever is at home but it's usually me, my little sister, my father and her), she uses eggs (which are not vegan), even if I will be there. How can I tell her that I find it hurtful to completely ignore the fact that I'm vegan, and thus can't eat the dessert?
Background
I'm 23, I have been vegan for 2 years, I live in my parents' house (well, not the past 6 months but I'm moving in again). I often cook the meal or part of it.
My mom hates cooking (I hate it too). She also doesn't like that I'm vegan and would probably wish for me to "convert back".
For the meal, there isn't a "main dish", there is just vegetables and starchy cook separately from the meat to make the meal vegan for me.
If she cooks something that needs milk/butter, she uses vegan alternatives but, if she needs eggs, she won't use the vegan alternative.
What I have tried
When I see that she is about to prepare a (non-vegan) cake, I ask her, why not use some maize starch(or some compote, depending) instead but she always told me "that's not how I learned to cook" or some similar excuse.
Sometimes, she will also say: if you aren't happy, you can cook. But the problem is, I do cook sometimes (just not cake) and I don't want to always have to do the cooking just because I'm the only vegan at home. Even though I know what to use as an alternative and would be able to tell her.
I didn't tell her (yet) that I found her hurtful because I wanted to avoid this (probably) difficult conversation.
Question
How can I communicate to my mother that I find it hurtful when she cooks for everyone but me?
Notes and clarifications
My mother does cook vegan stuff sometimes but only if she only needs to switch cow milk with rice milk. If it involves eggs, she won't switch ingredients.
When there are multiple things to eat, I don't really mind not eating something but when there is only one dessert, I do mind. Especially since this happens on a regular base (~ once per week).
Please, don't tell me that I'm selfish. I just want to be able to enjoy a vegan cake the same way they enjoy the vegan meals that I make.
No, I can't go out and buy a vegan cake, they're not readily available where I live.
A lot of answers suggest to teach her to cook vegan. This might work, but it might also not work: last time I tried, she just let me do the waffles on my own. So, I would be grateful for other solutions that do not involve cooking.
If the dessert is vegan, everyone will happily eat it.
My mother usually cooks 2/4 of time, me 1/4 and my father 1/4. At least that's how I see things but everyone on the house probably has a different opinion on the matter.
The cake is usually for the four of us (well, three of them since I can't eat it). If it's for guests, I mind less not being able to eat it (because it's not really for me, because I usually know in advance and because I can prepare/buy myself something else if needed).
Some people seem to think that I'm vegan for health reason, I'm really, really not. And the last time I tried to eat a not vegan cake, I didn't enjoy it because I felt guilty.
Follow up
I have asked my mother to tell me every time she wants to use eggs in a recipe (so that I can jump in and use something else instead).
I also printed and pinned on the fridge a summary table of what to use instead of eggs.
Finally, today, when my mother told me she wanted to make a pie using eggs, I jumped in and used Maizena instead (will she was cooking some other stuff). We didn't cook together but she mostly saw what I did and I hope that, if I do it often enough, she will start doing it by herself.
(but answers to help bring that issue with her are still very welcome if all this doesn't work)
Notes and clarification:
I would rather have the answer to "How to communicate to my mother that I find it hurtful when..." but people keep giving me answers to "how to have her cook vegan" so I used their solution in the hope that I won't need to "communicate that I find it hurtful when..."
family conflicts parents france eating
TL;DR
When my mom bakes a cake for us (whoever is at home but it's usually me, my little sister, my father and her), she uses eggs (which are not vegan), even if I will be there. How can I tell her that I find it hurtful to completely ignore the fact that I'm vegan, and thus can't eat the dessert?
Background
I'm 23, I have been vegan for 2 years, I live in my parents' house (well, not the past 6 months but I'm moving in again). I often cook the meal or part of it.
My mom hates cooking (I hate it too). She also doesn't like that I'm vegan and would probably wish for me to "convert back".
For the meal, there isn't a "main dish", there is just vegetables and starchy cook separately from the meat to make the meal vegan for me.
If she cooks something that needs milk/butter, she uses vegan alternatives but, if she needs eggs, she won't use the vegan alternative.
What I have tried
When I see that she is about to prepare a (non-vegan) cake, I ask her, why not use some maize starch(or some compote, depending) instead but she always told me "that's not how I learned to cook" or some similar excuse.
Sometimes, she will also say: if you aren't happy, you can cook. But the problem is, I do cook sometimes (just not cake) and I don't want to always have to do the cooking just because I'm the only vegan at home. Even though I know what to use as an alternative and would be able to tell her.
I didn't tell her (yet) that I found her hurtful because I wanted to avoid this (probably) difficult conversation.
Question
How can I communicate to my mother that I find it hurtful when she cooks for everyone but me?
Notes and clarifications
My mother does cook vegan stuff sometimes but only if she only needs to switch cow milk with rice milk. If it involves eggs, she won't switch ingredients.
When there are multiple things to eat, I don't really mind not eating something but when there is only one dessert, I do mind. Especially since this happens on a regular base (~ once per week).
Please, don't tell me that I'm selfish. I just want to be able to enjoy a vegan cake the same way they enjoy the vegan meals that I make.
No, I can't go out and buy a vegan cake, they're not readily available where I live.
A lot of answers suggest to teach her to cook vegan. This might work, but it might also not work: last time I tried, she just let me do the waffles on my own. So, I would be grateful for other solutions that do not involve cooking.
If the dessert is vegan, everyone will happily eat it.
My mother usually cooks 2/4 of time, me 1/4 and my father 1/4. At least that's how I see things but everyone on the house probably has a different opinion on the matter.
The cake is usually for the four of us (well, three of them since I can't eat it). If it's for guests, I mind less not being able to eat it (because it's not really for me, because I usually know in advance and because I can prepare/buy myself something else if needed).
Some people seem to think that I'm vegan for health reason, I'm really, really not. And the last time I tried to eat a not vegan cake, I didn't enjoy it because I felt guilty.
Follow up
I have asked my mother to tell me every time she wants to use eggs in a recipe (so that I can jump in and use something else instead).
I also printed and pinned on the fridge a summary table of what to use instead of eggs.
Finally, today, when my mother told me she wanted to make a pie using eggs, I jumped in and used Maizena instead (will she was cooking some other stuff). We didn't cook together but she mostly saw what I did and I hope that, if I do it often enough, she will start doing it by herself.
(but answers to help bring that issue with her are still very welcome if all this doesn't work)
Notes and clarification:
I would rather have the answer to "How to communicate to my mother that I find it hurtful when..." but people keep giving me answers to "how to have her cook vegan" so I used their solution in the hope that I won't need to "communicate that I find it hurtful when..."
family conflicts parents france eating
family conflicts parents france eating
edited 2 days ago
stannius
1074
1074
asked Sep 27 at 11:11
Noon
2,8772928
2,8772928
2
Please donâÂÂt write answers in comments. It bypasses our quality measures by not having voting (both up and down) available on comments, as well as having other problems detailed on meta. Comments are for clarifying and improving the question; please donâÂÂt use them for other purposes.
â Tinkeringbellâ¦
Oct 1 at 11:17
1
You assume that your mother cooks for you four, but you can't eat it. Does your mother thinks, she cooks for all the family or her position is more like "i cook, what i like. I'm fine with everybody eating, what i cooked"?
â fixerlt
Oct 2 at 12:03
1
@fixerlt She does cook what she likes but she always takes care of doing enough for everyone so, ...
â Noon
Oct 2 at 12:10
add a comment |Â
2
Please donâÂÂt write answers in comments. It bypasses our quality measures by not having voting (both up and down) available on comments, as well as having other problems detailed on meta. Comments are for clarifying and improving the question; please donâÂÂt use them for other purposes.
â Tinkeringbellâ¦
Oct 1 at 11:17
1
You assume that your mother cooks for you four, but you can't eat it. Does your mother thinks, she cooks for all the family or her position is more like "i cook, what i like. I'm fine with everybody eating, what i cooked"?
â fixerlt
Oct 2 at 12:03
1
@fixerlt She does cook what she likes but she always takes care of doing enough for everyone so, ...
â Noon
Oct 2 at 12:10
2
2
Please donâÂÂt write answers in comments. It bypasses our quality measures by not having voting (both up and down) available on comments, as well as having other problems detailed on meta. Comments are for clarifying and improving the question; please donâÂÂt use them for other purposes.
â Tinkeringbellâ¦
Oct 1 at 11:17
Please donâÂÂt write answers in comments. It bypasses our quality measures by not having voting (both up and down) available on comments, as well as having other problems detailed on meta. Comments are for clarifying and improving the question; please donâÂÂt use them for other purposes.
â Tinkeringbellâ¦
Oct 1 at 11:17
1
1
You assume that your mother cooks for you four, but you can't eat it. Does your mother thinks, she cooks for all the family or her position is more like "i cook, what i like. I'm fine with everybody eating, what i cooked"?
â fixerlt
Oct 2 at 12:03
You assume that your mother cooks for you four, but you can't eat it. Does your mother thinks, she cooks for all the family or her position is more like "i cook, what i like. I'm fine with everybody eating, what i cooked"?
â fixerlt
Oct 2 at 12:03
1
1
@fixerlt She does cook what she likes but she always takes care of doing enough for everyone so, ...
â Noon
Oct 2 at 12:10
@fixerlt She does cook what she likes but she always takes care of doing enough for everyone so, ...
â Noon
Oct 2 at 12:10
add a comment |Â
4 Answers
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Originally commented on a different answer, but I want to flesh this out into a full response -
Unlike other answers, I don't believe your primary choice is to just accept this as what it is and move on. However, I don't think that a monologue about how she's making you feel is going to make her more likely to accommodate you. If anything, approaching people with "I feel slighted by your behavior" usually makes people less likely to work with you. That's why, in the following paragraphs, I'm going to explain a more subtle way to express to your mother that you want to change the current norm, without making her feel under attack (which will increase your odds of success).
The key thing to remember here is that you chose to be vegan and take on all responsibilities that come with it: giving up certain foods, buying special (sometimes expensive) substitute ingredients, learning how to cook with these substitutes, etc. Unsurprisingly, your mom had no say in the matter. For someone who doesn't like to cook, the fact that she does make some vegan meals for you (aside from cake) is an important indicator that she is trying to accommodate for you.
Instead of pitting the cake issue as you vs your mom, view it as a moment where you need to be a teacher. You've said that your mom doesn't like to cook. As someone else who doesn't like to cook, I'm going to run on an assumption based on how I'd feel about learning to cook a common recipe with new, unfamiliar ingredients: Stressed. Learning how to do something you already don't enjoy in a different way can be overwhelming. This is your moment to teach that it isn't as big of a stress as it needs to be.
Invite yourself to cook a vegan cake with your mom. I'd recommend approaching it by saying:
"I've been upset that I haven't been able to eat any of the cake, but I understand that learning to cook specifically for my diet can feel like a big task. Would I be able to cook the next cake with you, and I can show you that it's actually pretty easy to substitute eggs for _____?"
What's important about your approach, which you'll see above, is that you come at your mom from an understanding angle while still expressing that you've been impacted by being left out from the eating of dessert. This is as far as I recommend going into your feelings with your mother. Once you've made this gesture of acknowledgement about her feelings, it'll increase the likelihood that she'll listen to you and accept your offer to show her how to make a vegan cake, because you're coming from an area of compromise and mutual acknowledgement. Remain prepared that you may still need to compromise, the cake may still not always be vegan (maybe others still want the egg-y cake sometimes or it's just more convenient for your mom)... but this will be a start to reducing the amount of stress she feels by accommodating for a diet she did not choose and isn't used to.
If she declines your offer, I'd take the opportunity to ask her why she doesn't want to learn. Express that you feel really left out and miss being able to enjoy her cake, and that you'd like to know why she won't compromise with you. Unfortunately if there's nothing you can do to help console her reasons, at this point you may just have to accept that she is unwilling to budge about learning this new cooking skillset.
All parties involved in this situation feel what they feel - selfish, rude, or otherwise. The best way to bridge this problem is with understanding and attempting to find a compromise, with emphasis and focus on OP and their mother, as asked in the question. Let's focus on positive suggestions and bridging the gap instead of criticizing OP's feelings.
7
Comments deleted. Please remember that comments are for requesting clarification or suggesting improvements, not arguing with the answer (or OP). Please see this meta post for more information.
â Em Câ¦
Sep 27 at 13:36
8
I think you've got your quote backward, shouldn't it say "easy to substitute __ for eggs"?
â Azor Ahai
Sep 30 at 21:53
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I'm not sure if I read that correctly, but I get the feeling this is also a lot about getting a cake baked by your mother - for you. As you say you find it hurtful when she bakes a non-vegan cake.
So, why not communicate THIS to your mother? Say something like:
I have so many happy memories involving cake you did bake for us.
Nowadays, with my being vegan, I can't anymore enjoy a cake my mother
baked. I feel so left out seeing you all eat this cake, and not being
able to participate. I know I chose my vegan lifestyle and so am
responsible for it. But eating a cake you baked is not only about a
tasty dessert, but a symbol for the love and the unity as a family. If
I get you a recipe and the ingredients for a vegan cake, and showed
you how to bake it that time, would you bake one for me the next time?
I just want to feel that feeling of having a cake my mummy made for
me...
By pointing out the symbolism of said cake and its significance to you, it wouldn't be about accommodating your "extravagant" lifestyle, but about a labour of love.
It's a simple technique derived from Marshall Rosenberg's violence-free communication.
I found that any time I used it, explaining my feelings and therefore the reason behind my plea, people are more declined to comply with my plea. Granted, I take this approach mostly with my family. The examples are varying... talking to my daughter about the necessity of wearing a helmet while riding her bike: I want her to be protected the best way, because I love her - instead of just ordering her to do it.. Asking my husband to wake me from napping with a hot tea: because it feels like being cared for and loved.
Of course there's a difference with my daughter STILL not wearing a helmet or my husband not making tea - the first gets a sterner talking and asking for her reasoning, the latter just gets a sigh and an "okay" - I may be disappointed, but there's no point into forcing somebody into a labour of love, is there? ;)
New contributor
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TL;DR
Time your communication better.
Telling her that she is being hurtful is not very amicable and would likely result in further defensive responses as it is probably hurtful that you do not like her food any more.
Based on your story, I believe the biggest stumbling block is the timing of your communication.
You say:
When I see that she is about to prepare a (non-vegan) cake, I ask her, why not use some Maizena (or some compote, depending) instead but she always told me "that's not how I learned to cook" or some similar excuse.
"why not use some Maizena" is specifically provoking a defensive response because the simple answer is "I am not familiar with it, why are you pushing this in my face right now?"
Trying to change the way that someone does something in the middle of execution is downright the most ineffective way of getting a person to change what they are doing. It provokes a sense of defensiveness because you are asking them to change in the middle of auto-pilot.
In your case, it is specific to cooking but it's true in countless aspects. Consider the following scenarios:
- To a student: hey I see you're studying biology tonight from textbook xyz, may I suggest textbook abc instead? It's better you know.
- To a carpenter: hey I see you're about to install the standard oak handrail, would you mind using this exotic wood instead?
- To a mechanic: Hey I see you're about to change my oil, can you rotate my tires first?
Do you see what I am getting at? You need to have a damn good reason for interrupting execution. Damn good reasons are usually limited to safety (hey, don't use peanuts or else 2 people will be hospitalized) and money (I know you were gonna install oak but I will pay for the labor and expenses for the exotic wood so make it happen, thanks.)
I see you have tried this multiple times but your results have been absolutely futile because she resorts to being defensive due to bad timing on your part.
However, based on her cooking vegan stuff sometimes does make it clear that she is trying and being receptive to your needs so that is good news.
My suggestion is to wait until a neutral time (2PM on a Sunday maybe?) when you can bring up your dietary wants. Additionally, now would be a good time to apologize that you've been trying to interject your veganism in the middle of meal-prep. State how much you appreciate the vegan dishes that she does make. Do not place blame for her wanting to cook in a way which is familiar. If you try telling her that she is being hurtful at any point then that will result in further defensiveness. YOU need to meet half way and offer to always keep egg substitutes stocked and provide some sort of ratio chart of one egg to whatever substitute. YOU should take this time to preemptively offer to cook dessert for a week straight.
Since this conversation will be held during a neutral time, you may even request your mother to take some time on non-busy day and teach you what she knows and you can collaborate and chime in with the substitutes that you know. This way you will both learn in a safe setting.
Being vegan is YOUR want in life so you absolutely cannot expect people to bend over backwards for you. However, people are usually willing to accommodate with enough notice so always be grateful anytime anyone steps out of their comfort zone.
Think about all of the things you had to learn and internalize when you made the choice to be vegan. Asking someone else to do the same in the middle of meal-prep is quite an egregious request.
Thank you for your answer. I believe you are right in saying that my timing is off and I'm definitely using the ratio chart from now on :)
â Noon
Oct 1 at 19:03
@Noon You're welcome, I've seen your question hovering around the Hot Network Questions for a few days now but after seeing the answer you did accept it made me question what your real goal is so I'm glad you clarified it.
â MonkeyZeus
Oct 1 at 19:06
I must admit that I accepted the nicest answer because I was sick of people upvoting the answer telling that I was selfish (I haven't decided yet if I will change the accepted answer, I'm probably gonna wait a little more before taking a decision).
â Noon
Oct 1 at 19:10
1
@Noon No worries. You're only obligation is to accept the answer which helped you most; this is not a popularity contest :-)
â MonkeyZeus
Oct 1 at 19:12
2
This is one of the few answers here that actually focuses on communicating about the veganism with the mother, but it seems heavily focused on 'getting mom to bake vegan cake' instead of the actual question, which is 'how to communicate to mom that I find this hurtful'. Would you say the same advice is applicable in both situations? Could you perhaps then edit your answer to make it more clear in one way or another that this will communicate to the mother that Noon feels hurt?
â Tinkeringbellâ¦
2 days ago
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Don't tell her directly, Use Different Tricks in Communication
Your sentence -
I didn't tell her (yet) that I found her hurtful because I wanted to avoid this (probably) difficult conversation.
Explanation
If you will going to tell her directly then it would be a difficult conversation.
You can use different tricks in communication so that your mom will not become angry at you (not ignore you) and she will understand your feelings also (that you get hurt).
You can follow the things before telling her about your hurtful feelings,
- Don't express your feelings in front of other people (they feel uncomfortable in front of other people, ask them in private)
- Compare yourself to another siblings ('you make for her (your sister) and not for
me', suffer them for guilty about not being fair) - Timing is everything (don't tell her in her bad mood, ask when she is
happy) - Work for it (Do some household activities in that day, they are
seeing that you are making efforts for family)
Before coming on exact point, appreciate her about all the things she has been doing for you. There may be some different way. You can use different tone (in polite way). You can hug her from her back, then it would be more good and pleasant atmosphere.
(You can use following poem or you can use your own wordings. I am giving you example)
For all the joy you brought to my life
For all the wrong that you made right
I'll be forever, thankful baby
You're the one who held me up Never let me fall
You're the one who saw me through through it all
You were my strength when I was weak
You saw the best there was in me
I'm everything I am Because you loved me
You're the one who can't ignore me
You're the one who can't hurt me
You gave me faith I can take decision
You gave me love I can't face your ignorance
Support me being vegetarian
(Note - We all know that every mom takes efforts for their child. Sometimes it needs words of appreciation for her. She would recognize that you understand her mind, care and feelings. It would help to reciprocate accordingly. In short, this small poem tells us that -- she has taken effort to make us happy, corrected our mistakes, motivated us, encouraged for good behavior. Now, I can take decision, I need your support, you can't ignore me because I am vegetarian, I love you mom.)
It is the best time to express your hurtful feelings,
I love you mom. I know, we need to cook separate vegan food for me only. But, I believe that you support about my decision being vegetarian. Sometimes whenever you cook dessert for everyone except me. I find it hurtful.
I hope this answer would help you.
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active
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up vote
120
down vote
accepted
Originally commented on a different answer, but I want to flesh this out into a full response -
Unlike other answers, I don't believe your primary choice is to just accept this as what it is and move on. However, I don't think that a monologue about how she's making you feel is going to make her more likely to accommodate you. If anything, approaching people with "I feel slighted by your behavior" usually makes people less likely to work with you. That's why, in the following paragraphs, I'm going to explain a more subtle way to express to your mother that you want to change the current norm, without making her feel under attack (which will increase your odds of success).
The key thing to remember here is that you chose to be vegan and take on all responsibilities that come with it: giving up certain foods, buying special (sometimes expensive) substitute ingredients, learning how to cook with these substitutes, etc. Unsurprisingly, your mom had no say in the matter. For someone who doesn't like to cook, the fact that she does make some vegan meals for you (aside from cake) is an important indicator that she is trying to accommodate for you.
Instead of pitting the cake issue as you vs your mom, view it as a moment where you need to be a teacher. You've said that your mom doesn't like to cook. As someone else who doesn't like to cook, I'm going to run on an assumption based on how I'd feel about learning to cook a common recipe with new, unfamiliar ingredients: Stressed. Learning how to do something you already don't enjoy in a different way can be overwhelming. This is your moment to teach that it isn't as big of a stress as it needs to be.
Invite yourself to cook a vegan cake with your mom. I'd recommend approaching it by saying:
"I've been upset that I haven't been able to eat any of the cake, but I understand that learning to cook specifically for my diet can feel like a big task. Would I be able to cook the next cake with you, and I can show you that it's actually pretty easy to substitute eggs for _____?"
What's important about your approach, which you'll see above, is that you come at your mom from an understanding angle while still expressing that you've been impacted by being left out from the eating of dessert. This is as far as I recommend going into your feelings with your mother. Once you've made this gesture of acknowledgement about her feelings, it'll increase the likelihood that she'll listen to you and accept your offer to show her how to make a vegan cake, because you're coming from an area of compromise and mutual acknowledgement. Remain prepared that you may still need to compromise, the cake may still not always be vegan (maybe others still want the egg-y cake sometimes or it's just more convenient for your mom)... but this will be a start to reducing the amount of stress she feels by accommodating for a diet she did not choose and isn't used to.
If she declines your offer, I'd take the opportunity to ask her why she doesn't want to learn. Express that you feel really left out and miss being able to enjoy her cake, and that you'd like to know why she won't compromise with you. Unfortunately if there's nothing you can do to help console her reasons, at this point you may just have to accept that she is unwilling to budge about learning this new cooking skillset.
All parties involved in this situation feel what they feel - selfish, rude, or otherwise. The best way to bridge this problem is with understanding and attempting to find a compromise, with emphasis and focus on OP and their mother, as asked in the question. Let's focus on positive suggestions and bridging the gap instead of criticizing OP's feelings.
7
Comments deleted. Please remember that comments are for requesting clarification or suggesting improvements, not arguing with the answer (or OP). Please see this meta post for more information.
â Em Câ¦
Sep 27 at 13:36
8
I think you've got your quote backward, shouldn't it say "easy to substitute __ for eggs"?
â Azor Ahai
Sep 30 at 21:53
add a comment |Â
up vote
120
down vote
accepted
Originally commented on a different answer, but I want to flesh this out into a full response -
Unlike other answers, I don't believe your primary choice is to just accept this as what it is and move on. However, I don't think that a monologue about how she's making you feel is going to make her more likely to accommodate you. If anything, approaching people with "I feel slighted by your behavior" usually makes people less likely to work with you. That's why, in the following paragraphs, I'm going to explain a more subtle way to express to your mother that you want to change the current norm, without making her feel under attack (which will increase your odds of success).
The key thing to remember here is that you chose to be vegan and take on all responsibilities that come with it: giving up certain foods, buying special (sometimes expensive) substitute ingredients, learning how to cook with these substitutes, etc. Unsurprisingly, your mom had no say in the matter. For someone who doesn't like to cook, the fact that she does make some vegan meals for you (aside from cake) is an important indicator that she is trying to accommodate for you.
Instead of pitting the cake issue as you vs your mom, view it as a moment where you need to be a teacher. You've said that your mom doesn't like to cook. As someone else who doesn't like to cook, I'm going to run on an assumption based on how I'd feel about learning to cook a common recipe with new, unfamiliar ingredients: Stressed. Learning how to do something you already don't enjoy in a different way can be overwhelming. This is your moment to teach that it isn't as big of a stress as it needs to be.
Invite yourself to cook a vegan cake with your mom. I'd recommend approaching it by saying:
"I've been upset that I haven't been able to eat any of the cake, but I understand that learning to cook specifically for my diet can feel like a big task. Would I be able to cook the next cake with you, and I can show you that it's actually pretty easy to substitute eggs for _____?"
What's important about your approach, which you'll see above, is that you come at your mom from an understanding angle while still expressing that you've been impacted by being left out from the eating of dessert. This is as far as I recommend going into your feelings with your mother. Once you've made this gesture of acknowledgement about her feelings, it'll increase the likelihood that she'll listen to you and accept your offer to show her how to make a vegan cake, because you're coming from an area of compromise and mutual acknowledgement. Remain prepared that you may still need to compromise, the cake may still not always be vegan (maybe others still want the egg-y cake sometimes or it's just more convenient for your mom)... but this will be a start to reducing the amount of stress she feels by accommodating for a diet she did not choose and isn't used to.
If she declines your offer, I'd take the opportunity to ask her why she doesn't want to learn. Express that you feel really left out and miss being able to enjoy her cake, and that you'd like to know why she won't compromise with you. Unfortunately if there's nothing you can do to help console her reasons, at this point you may just have to accept that she is unwilling to budge about learning this new cooking skillset.
All parties involved in this situation feel what they feel - selfish, rude, or otherwise. The best way to bridge this problem is with understanding and attempting to find a compromise, with emphasis and focus on OP and their mother, as asked in the question. Let's focus on positive suggestions and bridging the gap instead of criticizing OP's feelings.
7
Comments deleted. Please remember that comments are for requesting clarification or suggesting improvements, not arguing with the answer (or OP). Please see this meta post for more information.
â Em Câ¦
Sep 27 at 13:36
8
I think you've got your quote backward, shouldn't it say "easy to substitute __ for eggs"?
â Azor Ahai
Sep 30 at 21:53
add a comment |Â
up vote
120
down vote
accepted
up vote
120
down vote
accepted
Originally commented on a different answer, but I want to flesh this out into a full response -
Unlike other answers, I don't believe your primary choice is to just accept this as what it is and move on. However, I don't think that a monologue about how she's making you feel is going to make her more likely to accommodate you. If anything, approaching people with "I feel slighted by your behavior" usually makes people less likely to work with you. That's why, in the following paragraphs, I'm going to explain a more subtle way to express to your mother that you want to change the current norm, without making her feel under attack (which will increase your odds of success).
The key thing to remember here is that you chose to be vegan and take on all responsibilities that come with it: giving up certain foods, buying special (sometimes expensive) substitute ingredients, learning how to cook with these substitutes, etc. Unsurprisingly, your mom had no say in the matter. For someone who doesn't like to cook, the fact that she does make some vegan meals for you (aside from cake) is an important indicator that she is trying to accommodate for you.
Instead of pitting the cake issue as you vs your mom, view it as a moment where you need to be a teacher. You've said that your mom doesn't like to cook. As someone else who doesn't like to cook, I'm going to run on an assumption based on how I'd feel about learning to cook a common recipe with new, unfamiliar ingredients: Stressed. Learning how to do something you already don't enjoy in a different way can be overwhelming. This is your moment to teach that it isn't as big of a stress as it needs to be.
Invite yourself to cook a vegan cake with your mom. I'd recommend approaching it by saying:
"I've been upset that I haven't been able to eat any of the cake, but I understand that learning to cook specifically for my diet can feel like a big task. Would I be able to cook the next cake with you, and I can show you that it's actually pretty easy to substitute eggs for _____?"
What's important about your approach, which you'll see above, is that you come at your mom from an understanding angle while still expressing that you've been impacted by being left out from the eating of dessert. This is as far as I recommend going into your feelings with your mother. Once you've made this gesture of acknowledgement about her feelings, it'll increase the likelihood that she'll listen to you and accept your offer to show her how to make a vegan cake, because you're coming from an area of compromise and mutual acknowledgement. Remain prepared that you may still need to compromise, the cake may still not always be vegan (maybe others still want the egg-y cake sometimes or it's just more convenient for your mom)... but this will be a start to reducing the amount of stress she feels by accommodating for a diet she did not choose and isn't used to.
If she declines your offer, I'd take the opportunity to ask her why she doesn't want to learn. Express that you feel really left out and miss being able to enjoy her cake, and that you'd like to know why she won't compromise with you. Unfortunately if there's nothing you can do to help console her reasons, at this point you may just have to accept that she is unwilling to budge about learning this new cooking skillset.
All parties involved in this situation feel what they feel - selfish, rude, or otherwise. The best way to bridge this problem is with understanding and attempting to find a compromise, with emphasis and focus on OP and their mother, as asked in the question. Let's focus on positive suggestions and bridging the gap instead of criticizing OP's feelings.
Originally commented on a different answer, but I want to flesh this out into a full response -
Unlike other answers, I don't believe your primary choice is to just accept this as what it is and move on. However, I don't think that a monologue about how she's making you feel is going to make her more likely to accommodate you. If anything, approaching people with "I feel slighted by your behavior" usually makes people less likely to work with you. That's why, in the following paragraphs, I'm going to explain a more subtle way to express to your mother that you want to change the current norm, without making her feel under attack (which will increase your odds of success).
The key thing to remember here is that you chose to be vegan and take on all responsibilities that come with it: giving up certain foods, buying special (sometimes expensive) substitute ingredients, learning how to cook with these substitutes, etc. Unsurprisingly, your mom had no say in the matter. For someone who doesn't like to cook, the fact that she does make some vegan meals for you (aside from cake) is an important indicator that she is trying to accommodate for you.
Instead of pitting the cake issue as you vs your mom, view it as a moment where you need to be a teacher. You've said that your mom doesn't like to cook. As someone else who doesn't like to cook, I'm going to run on an assumption based on how I'd feel about learning to cook a common recipe with new, unfamiliar ingredients: Stressed. Learning how to do something you already don't enjoy in a different way can be overwhelming. This is your moment to teach that it isn't as big of a stress as it needs to be.
Invite yourself to cook a vegan cake with your mom. I'd recommend approaching it by saying:
"I've been upset that I haven't been able to eat any of the cake, but I understand that learning to cook specifically for my diet can feel like a big task. Would I be able to cook the next cake with you, and I can show you that it's actually pretty easy to substitute eggs for _____?"
What's important about your approach, which you'll see above, is that you come at your mom from an understanding angle while still expressing that you've been impacted by being left out from the eating of dessert. This is as far as I recommend going into your feelings with your mother. Once you've made this gesture of acknowledgement about her feelings, it'll increase the likelihood that she'll listen to you and accept your offer to show her how to make a vegan cake, because you're coming from an area of compromise and mutual acknowledgement. Remain prepared that you may still need to compromise, the cake may still not always be vegan (maybe others still want the egg-y cake sometimes or it's just more convenient for your mom)... but this will be a start to reducing the amount of stress she feels by accommodating for a diet she did not choose and isn't used to.
If she declines your offer, I'd take the opportunity to ask her why she doesn't want to learn. Express that you feel really left out and miss being able to enjoy her cake, and that you'd like to know why she won't compromise with you. Unfortunately if there's nothing you can do to help console her reasons, at this point you may just have to accept that she is unwilling to budge about learning this new cooking skillset.
All parties involved in this situation feel what they feel - selfish, rude, or otherwise. The best way to bridge this problem is with understanding and attempting to find a compromise, with emphasis and focus on OP and their mother, as asked in the question. Let's focus on positive suggestions and bridging the gap instead of criticizing OP's feelings.
edited 2 days ago
answered Sep 27 at 12:32
Jess K.
19.5k166389
19.5k166389
7
Comments deleted. Please remember that comments are for requesting clarification or suggesting improvements, not arguing with the answer (or OP). Please see this meta post for more information.
â Em Câ¦
Sep 27 at 13:36
8
I think you've got your quote backward, shouldn't it say "easy to substitute __ for eggs"?
â Azor Ahai
Sep 30 at 21:53
add a comment |Â
7
Comments deleted. Please remember that comments are for requesting clarification or suggesting improvements, not arguing with the answer (or OP). Please see this meta post for more information.
â Em Câ¦
Sep 27 at 13:36
8
I think you've got your quote backward, shouldn't it say "easy to substitute __ for eggs"?
â Azor Ahai
Sep 30 at 21:53
7
7
Comments deleted. Please remember that comments are for requesting clarification or suggesting improvements, not arguing with the answer (or OP). Please see this meta post for more information.
â Em Câ¦
Sep 27 at 13:36
Comments deleted. Please remember that comments are for requesting clarification or suggesting improvements, not arguing with the answer (or OP). Please see this meta post for more information.
â Em Câ¦
Sep 27 at 13:36
8
8
I think you've got your quote backward, shouldn't it say "easy to substitute __ for eggs"?
â Azor Ahai
Sep 30 at 21:53
I think you've got your quote backward, shouldn't it say "easy to substitute __ for eggs"?
â Azor Ahai
Sep 30 at 21:53
add a comment |Â
up vote
13
down vote
I'm not sure if I read that correctly, but I get the feeling this is also a lot about getting a cake baked by your mother - for you. As you say you find it hurtful when she bakes a non-vegan cake.
So, why not communicate THIS to your mother? Say something like:
I have so many happy memories involving cake you did bake for us.
Nowadays, with my being vegan, I can't anymore enjoy a cake my mother
baked. I feel so left out seeing you all eat this cake, and not being
able to participate. I know I chose my vegan lifestyle and so am
responsible for it. But eating a cake you baked is not only about a
tasty dessert, but a symbol for the love and the unity as a family. If
I get you a recipe and the ingredients for a vegan cake, and showed
you how to bake it that time, would you bake one for me the next time?
I just want to feel that feeling of having a cake my mummy made for
me...
By pointing out the symbolism of said cake and its significance to you, it wouldn't be about accommodating your "extravagant" lifestyle, but about a labour of love.
It's a simple technique derived from Marshall Rosenberg's violence-free communication.
I found that any time I used it, explaining my feelings and therefore the reason behind my plea, people are more declined to comply with my plea. Granted, I take this approach mostly with my family. The examples are varying... talking to my daughter about the necessity of wearing a helmet while riding her bike: I want her to be protected the best way, because I love her - instead of just ordering her to do it.. Asking my husband to wake me from napping with a hot tea: because it feels like being cared for and loved.
Of course there's a difference with my daughter STILL not wearing a helmet or my husband not making tea - the first gets a sterner talking and asking for her reasoning, the latter just gets a sigh and an "okay" - I may be disappointed, but there's no point into forcing somebody into a labour of love, is there? ;)
New contributor
add a comment |Â
up vote
13
down vote
I'm not sure if I read that correctly, but I get the feeling this is also a lot about getting a cake baked by your mother - for you. As you say you find it hurtful when she bakes a non-vegan cake.
So, why not communicate THIS to your mother? Say something like:
I have so many happy memories involving cake you did bake for us.
Nowadays, with my being vegan, I can't anymore enjoy a cake my mother
baked. I feel so left out seeing you all eat this cake, and not being
able to participate. I know I chose my vegan lifestyle and so am
responsible for it. But eating a cake you baked is not only about a
tasty dessert, but a symbol for the love and the unity as a family. If
I get you a recipe and the ingredients for a vegan cake, and showed
you how to bake it that time, would you bake one for me the next time?
I just want to feel that feeling of having a cake my mummy made for
me...
By pointing out the symbolism of said cake and its significance to you, it wouldn't be about accommodating your "extravagant" lifestyle, but about a labour of love.
It's a simple technique derived from Marshall Rosenberg's violence-free communication.
I found that any time I used it, explaining my feelings and therefore the reason behind my plea, people are more declined to comply with my plea. Granted, I take this approach mostly with my family. The examples are varying... talking to my daughter about the necessity of wearing a helmet while riding her bike: I want her to be protected the best way, because I love her - instead of just ordering her to do it.. Asking my husband to wake me from napping with a hot tea: because it feels like being cared for and loved.
Of course there's a difference with my daughter STILL not wearing a helmet or my husband not making tea - the first gets a sterner talking and asking for her reasoning, the latter just gets a sigh and an "okay" - I may be disappointed, but there's no point into forcing somebody into a labour of love, is there? ;)
New contributor
add a comment |Â
up vote
13
down vote
up vote
13
down vote
I'm not sure if I read that correctly, but I get the feeling this is also a lot about getting a cake baked by your mother - for you. As you say you find it hurtful when she bakes a non-vegan cake.
So, why not communicate THIS to your mother? Say something like:
I have so many happy memories involving cake you did bake for us.
Nowadays, with my being vegan, I can't anymore enjoy a cake my mother
baked. I feel so left out seeing you all eat this cake, and not being
able to participate. I know I chose my vegan lifestyle and so am
responsible for it. But eating a cake you baked is not only about a
tasty dessert, but a symbol for the love and the unity as a family. If
I get you a recipe and the ingredients for a vegan cake, and showed
you how to bake it that time, would you bake one for me the next time?
I just want to feel that feeling of having a cake my mummy made for
me...
By pointing out the symbolism of said cake and its significance to you, it wouldn't be about accommodating your "extravagant" lifestyle, but about a labour of love.
It's a simple technique derived from Marshall Rosenberg's violence-free communication.
I found that any time I used it, explaining my feelings and therefore the reason behind my plea, people are more declined to comply with my plea. Granted, I take this approach mostly with my family. The examples are varying... talking to my daughter about the necessity of wearing a helmet while riding her bike: I want her to be protected the best way, because I love her - instead of just ordering her to do it.. Asking my husband to wake me from napping with a hot tea: because it feels like being cared for and loved.
Of course there's a difference with my daughter STILL not wearing a helmet or my husband not making tea - the first gets a sterner talking and asking for her reasoning, the latter just gets a sigh and an "okay" - I may be disappointed, but there's no point into forcing somebody into a labour of love, is there? ;)
New contributor
I'm not sure if I read that correctly, but I get the feeling this is also a lot about getting a cake baked by your mother - for you. As you say you find it hurtful when she bakes a non-vegan cake.
So, why not communicate THIS to your mother? Say something like:
I have so many happy memories involving cake you did bake for us.
Nowadays, with my being vegan, I can't anymore enjoy a cake my mother
baked. I feel so left out seeing you all eat this cake, and not being
able to participate. I know I chose my vegan lifestyle and so am
responsible for it. But eating a cake you baked is not only about a
tasty dessert, but a symbol for the love and the unity as a family. If
I get you a recipe and the ingredients for a vegan cake, and showed
you how to bake it that time, would you bake one for me the next time?
I just want to feel that feeling of having a cake my mummy made for
me...
By pointing out the symbolism of said cake and its significance to you, it wouldn't be about accommodating your "extravagant" lifestyle, but about a labour of love.
It's a simple technique derived from Marshall Rosenberg's violence-free communication.
I found that any time I used it, explaining my feelings and therefore the reason behind my plea, people are more declined to comply with my plea. Granted, I take this approach mostly with my family. The examples are varying... talking to my daughter about the necessity of wearing a helmet while riding her bike: I want her to be protected the best way, because I love her - instead of just ordering her to do it.. Asking my husband to wake me from napping with a hot tea: because it feels like being cared for and loved.
Of course there's a difference with my daughter STILL not wearing a helmet or my husband not making tea - the first gets a sterner talking and asking for her reasoning, the latter just gets a sigh and an "okay" - I may be disappointed, but there's no point into forcing somebody into a labour of love, is there? ;)
New contributor
edited Oct 3 at 0:46
Em Câ¦
8,67623568
8,67623568
New contributor
answered Sep 30 at 12:51
bstabens
1553
1553
New contributor
New contributor
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
up vote
12
down vote
TL;DR
Time your communication better.
Telling her that she is being hurtful is not very amicable and would likely result in further defensive responses as it is probably hurtful that you do not like her food any more.
Based on your story, I believe the biggest stumbling block is the timing of your communication.
You say:
When I see that she is about to prepare a (non-vegan) cake, I ask her, why not use some Maizena (or some compote, depending) instead but she always told me "that's not how I learned to cook" or some similar excuse.
"why not use some Maizena" is specifically provoking a defensive response because the simple answer is "I am not familiar with it, why are you pushing this in my face right now?"
Trying to change the way that someone does something in the middle of execution is downright the most ineffective way of getting a person to change what they are doing. It provokes a sense of defensiveness because you are asking them to change in the middle of auto-pilot.
In your case, it is specific to cooking but it's true in countless aspects. Consider the following scenarios:
- To a student: hey I see you're studying biology tonight from textbook xyz, may I suggest textbook abc instead? It's better you know.
- To a carpenter: hey I see you're about to install the standard oak handrail, would you mind using this exotic wood instead?
- To a mechanic: Hey I see you're about to change my oil, can you rotate my tires first?
Do you see what I am getting at? You need to have a damn good reason for interrupting execution. Damn good reasons are usually limited to safety (hey, don't use peanuts or else 2 people will be hospitalized) and money (I know you were gonna install oak but I will pay for the labor and expenses for the exotic wood so make it happen, thanks.)
I see you have tried this multiple times but your results have been absolutely futile because she resorts to being defensive due to bad timing on your part.
However, based on her cooking vegan stuff sometimes does make it clear that she is trying and being receptive to your needs so that is good news.
My suggestion is to wait until a neutral time (2PM on a Sunday maybe?) when you can bring up your dietary wants. Additionally, now would be a good time to apologize that you've been trying to interject your veganism in the middle of meal-prep. State how much you appreciate the vegan dishes that she does make. Do not place blame for her wanting to cook in a way which is familiar. If you try telling her that she is being hurtful at any point then that will result in further defensiveness. YOU need to meet half way and offer to always keep egg substitutes stocked and provide some sort of ratio chart of one egg to whatever substitute. YOU should take this time to preemptively offer to cook dessert for a week straight.
Since this conversation will be held during a neutral time, you may even request your mother to take some time on non-busy day and teach you what she knows and you can collaborate and chime in with the substitutes that you know. This way you will both learn in a safe setting.
Being vegan is YOUR want in life so you absolutely cannot expect people to bend over backwards for you. However, people are usually willing to accommodate with enough notice so always be grateful anytime anyone steps out of their comfort zone.
Think about all of the things you had to learn and internalize when you made the choice to be vegan. Asking someone else to do the same in the middle of meal-prep is quite an egregious request.
Thank you for your answer. I believe you are right in saying that my timing is off and I'm definitely using the ratio chart from now on :)
â Noon
Oct 1 at 19:03
@Noon You're welcome, I've seen your question hovering around the Hot Network Questions for a few days now but after seeing the answer you did accept it made me question what your real goal is so I'm glad you clarified it.
â MonkeyZeus
Oct 1 at 19:06
I must admit that I accepted the nicest answer because I was sick of people upvoting the answer telling that I was selfish (I haven't decided yet if I will change the accepted answer, I'm probably gonna wait a little more before taking a decision).
â Noon
Oct 1 at 19:10
1
@Noon No worries. You're only obligation is to accept the answer which helped you most; this is not a popularity contest :-)
â MonkeyZeus
Oct 1 at 19:12
2
This is one of the few answers here that actually focuses on communicating about the veganism with the mother, but it seems heavily focused on 'getting mom to bake vegan cake' instead of the actual question, which is 'how to communicate to mom that I find this hurtful'. Would you say the same advice is applicable in both situations? Could you perhaps then edit your answer to make it more clear in one way or another that this will communicate to the mother that Noon feels hurt?
â Tinkeringbellâ¦
2 days ago
 |Â
show 1 more comment
up vote
12
down vote
TL;DR
Time your communication better.
Telling her that she is being hurtful is not very amicable and would likely result in further defensive responses as it is probably hurtful that you do not like her food any more.
Based on your story, I believe the biggest stumbling block is the timing of your communication.
You say:
When I see that she is about to prepare a (non-vegan) cake, I ask her, why not use some Maizena (or some compote, depending) instead but she always told me "that's not how I learned to cook" or some similar excuse.
"why not use some Maizena" is specifically provoking a defensive response because the simple answer is "I am not familiar with it, why are you pushing this in my face right now?"
Trying to change the way that someone does something in the middle of execution is downright the most ineffective way of getting a person to change what they are doing. It provokes a sense of defensiveness because you are asking them to change in the middle of auto-pilot.
In your case, it is specific to cooking but it's true in countless aspects. Consider the following scenarios:
- To a student: hey I see you're studying biology tonight from textbook xyz, may I suggest textbook abc instead? It's better you know.
- To a carpenter: hey I see you're about to install the standard oak handrail, would you mind using this exotic wood instead?
- To a mechanic: Hey I see you're about to change my oil, can you rotate my tires first?
Do you see what I am getting at? You need to have a damn good reason for interrupting execution. Damn good reasons are usually limited to safety (hey, don't use peanuts or else 2 people will be hospitalized) and money (I know you were gonna install oak but I will pay for the labor and expenses for the exotic wood so make it happen, thanks.)
I see you have tried this multiple times but your results have been absolutely futile because she resorts to being defensive due to bad timing on your part.
However, based on her cooking vegan stuff sometimes does make it clear that she is trying and being receptive to your needs so that is good news.
My suggestion is to wait until a neutral time (2PM on a Sunday maybe?) when you can bring up your dietary wants. Additionally, now would be a good time to apologize that you've been trying to interject your veganism in the middle of meal-prep. State how much you appreciate the vegan dishes that she does make. Do not place blame for her wanting to cook in a way which is familiar. If you try telling her that she is being hurtful at any point then that will result in further defensiveness. YOU need to meet half way and offer to always keep egg substitutes stocked and provide some sort of ratio chart of one egg to whatever substitute. YOU should take this time to preemptively offer to cook dessert for a week straight.
Since this conversation will be held during a neutral time, you may even request your mother to take some time on non-busy day and teach you what she knows and you can collaborate and chime in with the substitutes that you know. This way you will both learn in a safe setting.
Being vegan is YOUR want in life so you absolutely cannot expect people to bend over backwards for you. However, people are usually willing to accommodate with enough notice so always be grateful anytime anyone steps out of their comfort zone.
Think about all of the things you had to learn and internalize when you made the choice to be vegan. Asking someone else to do the same in the middle of meal-prep is quite an egregious request.
Thank you for your answer. I believe you are right in saying that my timing is off and I'm definitely using the ratio chart from now on :)
â Noon
Oct 1 at 19:03
@Noon You're welcome, I've seen your question hovering around the Hot Network Questions for a few days now but after seeing the answer you did accept it made me question what your real goal is so I'm glad you clarified it.
â MonkeyZeus
Oct 1 at 19:06
I must admit that I accepted the nicest answer because I was sick of people upvoting the answer telling that I was selfish (I haven't decided yet if I will change the accepted answer, I'm probably gonna wait a little more before taking a decision).
â Noon
Oct 1 at 19:10
1
@Noon No worries. You're only obligation is to accept the answer which helped you most; this is not a popularity contest :-)
â MonkeyZeus
Oct 1 at 19:12
2
This is one of the few answers here that actually focuses on communicating about the veganism with the mother, but it seems heavily focused on 'getting mom to bake vegan cake' instead of the actual question, which is 'how to communicate to mom that I find this hurtful'. Would you say the same advice is applicable in both situations? Could you perhaps then edit your answer to make it more clear in one way or another that this will communicate to the mother that Noon feels hurt?
â Tinkeringbellâ¦
2 days ago
 |Â
show 1 more comment
up vote
12
down vote
up vote
12
down vote
TL;DR
Time your communication better.
Telling her that she is being hurtful is not very amicable and would likely result in further defensive responses as it is probably hurtful that you do not like her food any more.
Based on your story, I believe the biggest stumbling block is the timing of your communication.
You say:
When I see that she is about to prepare a (non-vegan) cake, I ask her, why not use some Maizena (or some compote, depending) instead but she always told me "that's not how I learned to cook" or some similar excuse.
"why not use some Maizena" is specifically provoking a defensive response because the simple answer is "I am not familiar with it, why are you pushing this in my face right now?"
Trying to change the way that someone does something in the middle of execution is downright the most ineffective way of getting a person to change what they are doing. It provokes a sense of defensiveness because you are asking them to change in the middle of auto-pilot.
In your case, it is specific to cooking but it's true in countless aspects. Consider the following scenarios:
- To a student: hey I see you're studying biology tonight from textbook xyz, may I suggest textbook abc instead? It's better you know.
- To a carpenter: hey I see you're about to install the standard oak handrail, would you mind using this exotic wood instead?
- To a mechanic: Hey I see you're about to change my oil, can you rotate my tires first?
Do you see what I am getting at? You need to have a damn good reason for interrupting execution. Damn good reasons are usually limited to safety (hey, don't use peanuts or else 2 people will be hospitalized) and money (I know you were gonna install oak but I will pay for the labor and expenses for the exotic wood so make it happen, thanks.)
I see you have tried this multiple times but your results have been absolutely futile because she resorts to being defensive due to bad timing on your part.
However, based on her cooking vegan stuff sometimes does make it clear that she is trying and being receptive to your needs so that is good news.
My suggestion is to wait until a neutral time (2PM on a Sunday maybe?) when you can bring up your dietary wants. Additionally, now would be a good time to apologize that you've been trying to interject your veganism in the middle of meal-prep. State how much you appreciate the vegan dishes that she does make. Do not place blame for her wanting to cook in a way which is familiar. If you try telling her that she is being hurtful at any point then that will result in further defensiveness. YOU need to meet half way and offer to always keep egg substitutes stocked and provide some sort of ratio chart of one egg to whatever substitute. YOU should take this time to preemptively offer to cook dessert for a week straight.
Since this conversation will be held during a neutral time, you may even request your mother to take some time on non-busy day and teach you what she knows and you can collaborate and chime in with the substitutes that you know. This way you will both learn in a safe setting.
Being vegan is YOUR want in life so you absolutely cannot expect people to bend over backwards for you. However, people are usually willing to accommodate with enough notice so always be grateful anytime anyone steps out of their comfort zone.
Think about all of the things you had to learn and internalize when you made the choice to be vegan. Asking someone else to do the same in the middle of meal-prep is quite an egregious request.
TL;DR
Time your communication better.
Telling her that she is being hurtful is not very amicable and would likely result in further defensive responses as it is probably hurtful that you do not like her food any more.
Based on your story, I believe the biggest stumbling block is the timing of your communication.
You say:
When I see that she is about to prepare a (non-vegan) cake, I ask her, why not use some Maizena (or some compote, depending) instead but she always told me "that's not how I learned to cook" or some similar excuse.
"why not use some Maizena" is specifically provoking a defensive response because the simple answer is "I am not familiar with it, why are you pushing this in my face right now?"
Trying to change the way that someone does something in the middle of execution is downright the most ineffective way of getting a person to change what they are doing. It provokes a sense of defensiveness because you are asking them to change in the middle of auto-pilot.
In your case, it is specific to cooking but it's true in countless aspects. Consider the following scenarios:
- To a student: hey I see you're studying biology tonight from textbook xyz, may I suggest textbook abc instead? It's better you know.
- To a carpenter: hey I see you're about to install the standard oak handrail, would you mind using this exotic wood instead?
- To a mechanic: Hey I see you're about to change my oil, can you rotate my tires first?
Do you see what I am getting at? You need to have a damn good reason for interrupting execution. Damn good reasons are usually limited to safety (hey, don't use peanuts or else 2 people will be hospitalized) and money (I know you were gonna install oak but I will pay for the labor and expenses for the exotic wood so make it happen, thanks.)
I see you have tried this multiple times but your results have been absolutely futile because she resorts to being defensive due to bad timing on your part.
However, based on her cooking vegan stuff sometimes does make it clear that she is trying and being receptive to your needs so that is good news.
My suggestion is to wait until a neutral time (2PM on a Sunday maybe?) when you can bring up your dietary wants. Additionally, now would be a good time to apologize that you've been trying to interject your veganism in the middle of meal-prep. State how much you appreciate the vegan dishes that she does make. Do not place blame for her wanting to cook in a way which is familiar. If you try telling her that she is being hurtful at any point then that will result in further defensiveness. YOU need to meet half way and offer to always keep egg substitutes stocked and provide some sort of ratio chart of one egg to whatever substitute. YOU should take this time to preemptively offer to cook dessert for a week straight.
Since this conversation will be held during a neutral time, you may even request your mother to take some time on non-busy day and teach you what she knows and you can collaborate and chime in with the substitutes that you know. This way you will both learn in a safe setting.
Being vegan is YOUR want in life so you absolutely cannot expect people to bend over backwards for you. However, people are usually willing to accommodate with enough notice so always be grateful anytime anyone steps out of their comfort zone.
Think about all of the things you had to learn and internalize when you made the choice to be vegan. Asking someone else to do the same in the middle of meal-prep is quite an egregious request.
edited 14 hours ago
answered Oct 1 at 18:46
MonkeyZeus
4,5531823
4,5531823
Thank you for your answer. I believe you are right in saying that my timing is off and I'm definitely using the ratio chart from now on :)
â Noon
Oct 1 at 19:03
@Noon You're welcome, I've seen your question hovering around the Hot Network Questions for a few days now but after seeing the answer you did accept it made me question what your real goal is so I'm glad you clarified it.
â MonkeyZeus
Oct 1 at 19:06
I must admit that I accepted the nicest answer because I was sick of people upvoting the answer telling that I was selfish (I haven't decided yet if I will change the accepted answer, I'm probably gonna wait a little more before taking a decision).
â Noon
Oct 1 at 19:10
1
@Noon No worries. You're only obligation is to accept the answer which helped you most; this is not a popularity contest :-)
â MonkeyZeus
Oct 1 at 19:12
2
This is one of the few answers here that actually focuses on communicating about the veganism with the mother, but it seems heavily focused on 'getting mom to bake vegan cake' instead of the actual question, which is 'how to communicate to mom that I find this hurtful'. Would you say the same advice is applicable in both situations? Could you perhaps then edit your answer to make it more clear in one way or another that this will communicate to the mother that Noon feels hurt?
â Tinkeringbellâ¦
2 days ago
 |Â
show 1 more comment
Thank you for your answer. I believe you are right in saying that my timing is off and I'm definitely using the ratio chart from now on :)
â Noon
Oct 1 at 19:03
@Noon You're welcome, I've seen your question hovering around the Hot Network Questions for a few days now but after seeing the answer you did accept it made me question what your real goal is so I'm glad you clarified it.
â MonkeyZeus
Oct 1 at 19:06
I must admit that I accepted the nicest answer because I was sick of people upvoting the answer telling that I was selfish (I haven't decided yet if I will change the accepted answer, I'm probably gonna wait a little more before taking a decision).
â Noon
Oct 1 at 19:10
1
@Noon No worries. You're only obligation is to accept the answer which helped you most; this is not a popularity contest :-)
â MonkeyZeus
Oct 1 at 19:12
2
This is one of the few answers here that actually focuses on communicating about the veganism with the mother, but it seems heavily focused on 'getting mom to bake vegan cake' instead of the actual question, which is 'how to communicate to mom that I find this hurtful'. Would you say the same advice is applicable in both situations? Could you perhaps then edit your answer to make it more clear in one way or another that this will communicate to the mother that Noon feels hurt?
â Tinkeringbellâ¦
2 days ago
Thank you for your answer. I believe you are right in saying that my timing is off and I'm definitely using the ratio chart from now on :)
â Noon
Oct 1 at 19:03
Thank you for your answer. I believe you are right in saying that my timing is off and I'm definitely using the ratio chart from now on :)
â Noon
Oct 1 at 19:03
@Noon You're welcome, I've seen your question hovering around the Hot Network Questions for a few days now but after seeing the answer you did accept it made me question what your real goal is so I'm glad you clarified it.
â MonkeyZeus
Oct 1 at 19:06
@Noon You're welcome, I've seen your question hovering around the Hot Network Questions for a few days now but after seeing the answer you did accept it made me question what your real goal is so I'm glad you clarified it.
â MonkeyZeus
Oct 1 at 19:06
I must admit that I accepted the nicest answer because I was sick of people upvoting the answer telling that I was selfish (I haven't decided yet if I will change the accepted answer, I'm probably gonna wait a little more before taking a decision).
â Noon
Oct 1 at 19:10
I must admit that I accepted the nicest answer because I was sick of people upvoting the answer telling that I was selfish (I haven't decided yet if I will change the accepted answer, I'm probably gonna wait a little more before taking a decision).
â Noon
Oct 1 at 19:10
1
1
@Noon No worries. You're only obligation is to accept the answer which helped you most; this is not a popularity contest :-)
â MonkeyZeus
Oct 1 at 19:12
@Noon No worries. You're only obligation is to accept the answer which helped you most; this is not a popularity contest :-)
â MonkeyZeus
Oct 1 at 19:12
2
2
This is one of the few answers here that actually focuses on communicating about the veganism with the mother, but it seems heavily focused on 'getting mom to bake vegan cake' instead of the actual question, which is 'how to communicate to mom that I find this hurtful'. Would you say the same advice is applicable in both situations? Could you perhaps then edit your answer to make it more clear in one way or another that this will communicate to the mother that Noon feels hurt?
â Tinkeringbellâ¦
2 days ago
This is one of the few answers here that actually focuses on communicating about the veganism with the mother, but it seems heavily focused on 'getting mom to bake vegan cake' instead of the actual question, which is 'how to communicate to mom that I find this hurtful'. Would you say the same advice is applicable in both situations? Could you perhaps then edit your answer to make it more clear in one way or another that this will communicate to the mother that Noon feels hurt?
â Tinkeringbellâ¦
2 days ago
 |Â
show 1 more comment
up vote
-1
down vote
Don't tell her directly, Use Different Tricks in Communication
Your sentence -
I didn't tell her (yet) that I found her hurtful because I wanted to avoid this (probably) difficult conversation.
Explanation
If you will going to tell her directly then it would be a difficult conversation.
You can use different tricks in communication so that your mom will not become angry at you (not ignore you) and she will understand your feelings also (that you get hurt).
You can follow the things before telling her about your hurtful feelings,
- Don't express your feelings in front of other people (they feel uncomfortable in front of other people, ask them in private)
- Compare yourself to another siblings ('you make for her (your sister) and not for
me', suffer them for guilty about not being fair) - Timing is everything (don't tell her in her bad mood, ask when she is
happy) - Work for it (Do some household activities in that day, they are
seeing that you are making efforts for family)
Before coming on exact point, appreciate her about all the things she has been doing for you. There may be some different way. You can use different tone (in polite way). You can hug her from her back, then it would be more good and pleasant atmosphere.
(You can use following poem or you can use your own wordings. I am giving you example)
For all the joy you brought to my life
For all the wrong that you made right
I'll be forever, thankful baby
You're the one who held me up Never let me fall
You're the one who saw me through through it all
You were my strength when I was weak
You saw the best there was in me
I'm everything I am Because you loved me
You're the one who can't ignore me
You're the one who can't hurt me
You gave me faith I can take decision
You gave me love I can't face your ignorance
Support me being vegetarian
(Note - We all know that every mom takes efforts for their child. Sometimes it needs words of appreciation for her. She would recognize that you understand her mind, care and feelings. It would help to reciprocate accordingly. In short, this small poem tells us that -- she has taken effort to make us happy, corrected our mistakes, motivated us, encouraged for good behavior. Now, I can take decision, I need your support, you can't ignore me because I am vegetarian, I love you mom.)
It is the best time to express your hurtful feelings,
I love you mom. I know, we need to cook separate vegan food for me only. But, I believe that you support about my decision being vegetarian. Sometimes whenever you cook dessert for everyone except me. I find it hurtful.
I hope this answer would help you.
add a comment |Â
up vote
-1
down vote
Don't tell her directly, Use Different Tricks in Communication
Your sentence -
I didn't tell her (yet) that I found her hurtful because I wanted to avoid this (probably) difficult conversation.
Explanation
If you will going to tell her directly then it would be a difficult conversation.
You can use different tricks in communication so that your mom will not become angry at you (not ignore you) and she will understand your feelings also (that you get hurt).
You can follow the things before telling her about your hurtful feelings,
- Don't express your feelings in front of other people (they feel uncomfortable in front of other people, ask them in private)
- Compare yourself to another siblings ('you make for her (your sister) and not for
me', suffer them for guilty about not being fair) - Timing is everything (don't tell her in her bad mood, ask when she is
happy) - Work for it (Do some household activities in that day, they are
seeing that you are making efforts for family)
Before coming on exact point, appreciate her about all the things she has been doing for you. There may be some different way. You can use different tone (in polite way). You can hug her from her back, then it would be more good and pleasant atmosphere.
(You can use following poem or you can use your own wordings. I am giving you example)
For all the joy you brought to my life
For all the wrong that you made right
I'll be forever, thankful baby
You're the one who held me up Never let me fall
You're the one who saw me through through it all
You were my strength when I was weak
You saw the best there was in me
I'm everything I am Because you loved me
You're the one who can't ignore me
You're the one who can't hurt me
You gave me faith I can take decision
You gave me love I can't face your ignorance
Support me being vegetarian
(Note - We all know that every mom takes efforts for their child. Sometimes it needs words of appreciation for her. She would recognize that you understand her mind, care and feelings. It would help to reciprocate accordingly. In short, this small poem tells us that -- she has taken effort to make us happy, corrected our mistakes, motivated us, encouraged for good behavior. Now, I can take decision, I need your support, you can't ignore me because I am vegetarian, I love you mom.)
It is the best time to express your hurtful feelings,
I love you mom. I know, we need to cook separate vegan food for me only. But, I believe that you support about my decision being vegetarian. Sometimes whenever you cook dessert for everyone except me. I find it hurtful.
I hope this answer would help you.
add a comment |Â
up vote
-1
down vote
up vote
-1
down vote
Don't tell her directly, Use Different Tricks in Communication
Your sentence -
I didn't tell her (yet) that I found her hurtful because I wanted to avoid this (probably) difficult conversation.
Explanation
If you will going to tell her directly then it would be a difficult conversation.
You can use different tricks in communication so that your mom will not become angry at you (not ignore you) and she will understand your feelings also (that you get hurt).
You can follow the things before telling her about your hurtful feelings,
- Don't express your feelings in front of other people (they feel uncomfortable in front of other people, ask them in private)
- Compare yourself to another siblings ('you make for her (your sister) and not for
me', suffer them for guilty about not being fair) - Timing is everything (don't tell her in her bad mood, ask when she is
happy) - Work for it (Do some household activities in that day, they are
seeing that you are making efforts for family)
Before coming on exact point, appreciate her about all the things she has been doing for you. There may be some different way. You can use different tone (in polite way). You can hug her from her back, then it would be more good and pleasant atmosphere.
(You can use following poem or you can use your own wordings. I am giving you example)
For all the joy you brought to my life
For all the wrong that you made right
I'll be forever, thankful baby
You're the one who held me up Never let me fall
You're the one who saw me through through it all
You were my strength when I was weak
You saw the best there was in me
I'm everything I am Because you loved me
You're the one who can't ignore me
You're the one who can't hurt me
You gave me faith I can take decision
You gave me love I can't face your ignorance
Support me being vegetarian
(Note - We all know that every mom takes efforts for their child. Sometimes it needs words of appreciation for her. She would recognize that you understand her mind, care and feelings. It would help to reciprocate accordingly. In short, this small poem tells us that -- she has taken effort to make us happy, corrected our mistakes, motivated us, encouraged for good behavior. Now, I can take decision, I need your support, you can't ignore me because I am vegetarian, I love you mom.)
It is the best time to express your hurtful feelings,
I love you mom. I know, we need to cook separate vegan food for me only. But, I believe that you support about my decision being vegetarian. Sometimes whenever you cook dessert for everyone except me. I find it hurtful.
I hope this answer would help you.
Don't tell her directly, Use Different Tricks in Communication
Your sentence -
I didn't tell her (yet) that I found her hurtful because I wanted to avoid this (probably) difficult conversation.
Explanation
If you will going to tell her directly then it would be a difficult conversation.
You can use different tricks in communication so that your mom will not become angry at you (not ignore you) and she will understand your feelings also (that you get hurt).
You can follow the things before telling her about your hurtful feelings,
- Don't express your feelings in front of other people (they feel uncomfortable in front of other people, ask them in private)
- Compare yourself to another siblings ('you make for her (your sister) and not for
me', suffer them for guilty about not being fair) - Timing is everything (don't tell her in her bad mood, ask when she is
happy) - Work for it (Do some household activities in that day, they are
seeing that you are making efforts for family)
Before coming on exact point, appreciate her about all the things she has been doing for you. There may be some different way. You can use different tone (in polite way). You can hug her from her back, then it would be more good and pleasant atmosphere.
(You can use following poem or you can use your own wordings. I am giving you example)
For all the joy you brought to my life
For all the wrong that you made right
I'll be forever, thankful baby
You're the one who held me up Never let me fall
You're the one who saw me through through it all
You were my strength when I was weak
You saw the best there was in me
I'm everything I am Because you loved me
You're the one who can't ignore me
You're the one who can't hurt me
You gave me faith I can take decision
You gave me love I can't face your ignorance
Support me being vegetarian
(Note - We all know that every mom takes efforts for their child. Sometimes it needs words of appreciation for her. She would recognize that you understand her mind, care and feelings. It would help to reciprocate accordingly. In short, this small poem tells us that -- she has taken effort to make us happy, corrected our mistakes, motivated us, encouraged for good behavior. Now, I can take decision, I need your support, you can't ignore me because I am vegetarian, I love you mom.)
It is the best time to express your hurtful feelings,
I love you mom. I know, we need to cook separate vegan food for me only. But, I believe that you support about my decision being vegetarian. Sometimes whenever you cook dessert for everyone except me. I find it hurtful.
I hope this answer would help you.
edited 11 hours ago
answered 16 hours ago
DDD
4601115
4601115
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
protected by avazula Oct 1 at 12:44
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â Tinkeringbellâ¦
Oct 1 at 11:17
1
You assume that your mother cooks for you four, but you can't eat it. Does your mother thinks, she cooks for all the family or her position is more like "i cook, what i like. I'm fine with everybody eating, what i cooked"?
â fixerlt
Oct 2 at 12:03
1
@fixerlt She does cook what she likes but she always takes care of doing enough for everyone so, ...
â Noon
Oct 2 at 12:10