Function with arbitrary small period
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Is there a function f: $mathbbR to mathbbR$ with arbitrary small period different from $f(x) = k$? ($forall epsilon >0 exists a < epsilon $ such that f(x) has a periodicity $a$)
I think the function is the Dirichlet function but I don't know how to prove it properly.
periodic-functions
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up vote
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Is there a function f: $mathbbR to mathbbR$ with arbitrary small period different from $f(x) = k$? ($forall epsilon >0 exists a < epsilon $ such that f(x) has a periodicity $a$)
I think the function is the Dirichlet function but I don't know how to prove it properly.
periodic-functions
New contributor
2
F(x)=1 for numbers with a halting decimal expansion, for example $3.452$ and not $1/3$
â Empy2
Oct 4 at 12:00
@Empy2 Nice: your example also works for domain $mathbbQ$.
â aschepler
Oct 4 at 12:38
3
I would avoid saying âÂÂsuch that the period of $f(x)$ is $a$â here. The term period would usually denote the smallest $a>0$ that fulfills $f(x+a) = f(x)$. Here you should rather just say âÂÂsuch that $f$ has a periodicity $a$âÂÂ, or âÂÂsuch that $f$ is $a$-periodicâÂÂ, which does assert $f(x+a) = f(x)$ but does not make any statement as to whether there exists also $b in ]0,a[$ with $f(x+b)=f(x)$.
â leftaroundabout
Oct 4 at 13:55
Of course you want $0<a<epsilon$
â MPW
Oct 4 at 18:07
You can construct a lot of such functions. The recipe: 1) Take any sequence $a_k$ which has infinite number of values in any neighbourhood of zero; 2) Make a set consisting of all finite sums of $a_k$ with arbitrary integer coefficients; 3) The characteristic function of this set will satisfy your requirements for $f$. If $a_k=1/k$ then you're getting rationals. If $a_k=10^-k$ then you're getting Empy2's set. If $a_k=k^-pi$ then you're getting new set which is hard to imagine :-) If $a_k=sink$ then you're getting new interesting set.
â Egor Skriptunoff
2 days ago
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up vote
10
down vote
favorite
up vote
10
down vote
favorite
Is there a function f: $mathbbR to mathbbR$ with arbitrary small period different from $f(x) = k$? ($forall epsilon >0 exists a < epsilon $ such that f(x) has a periodicity $a$)
I think the function is the Dirichlet function but I don't know how to prove it properly.
periodic-functions
New contributor
Is there a function f: $mathbbR to mathbbR$ with arbitrary small period different from $f(x) = k$? ($forall epsilon >0 exists a < epsilon $ such that f(x) has a periodicity $a$)
I think the function is the Dirichlet function but I don't know how to prove it properly.
periodic-functions
periodic-functions
New contributor
New contributor
edited Oct 4 at 19:06
New contributor
asked Oct 4 at 11:45
Lance
907
907
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New contributor
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F(x)=1 for numbers with a halting decimal expansion, for example $3.452$ and not $1/3$
â Empy2
Oct 4 at 12:00
@Empy2 Nice: your example also works for domain $mathbbQ$.
â aschepler
Oct 4 at 12:38
3
I would avoid saying âÂÂsuch that the period of $f(x)$ is $a$â here. The term period would usually denote the smallest $a>0$ that fulfills $f(x+a) = f(x)$. Here you should rather just say âÂÂsuch that $f$ has a periodicity $a$âÂÂ, or âÂÂsuch that $f$ is $a$-periodicâÂÂ, which does assert $f(x+a) = f(x)$ but does not make any statement as to whether there exists also $b in ]0,a[$ with $f(x+b)=f(x)$.
â leftaroundabout
Oct 4 at 13:55
Of course you want $0<a<epsilon$
â MPW
Oct 4 at 18:07
You can construct a lot of such functions. The recipe: 1) Take any sequence $a_k$ which has infinite number of values in any neighbourhood of zero; 2) Make a set consisting of all finite sums of $a_k$ with arbitrary integer coefficients; 3) The characteristic function of this set will satisfy your requirements for $f$. If $a_k=1/k$ then you're getting rationals. If $a_k=10^-k$ then you're getting Empy2's set. If $a_k=k^-pi$ then you're getting new set which is hard to imagine :-) If $a_k=sink$ then you're getting new interesting set.
â Egor Skriptunoff
2 days ago
add a comment |Â
2
F(x)=1 for numbers with a halting decimal expansion, for example $3.452$ and not $1/3$
â Empy2
Oct 4 at 12:00
@Empy2 Nice: your example also works for domain $mathbbQ$.
â aschepler
Oct 4 at 12:38
3
I would avoid saying âÂÂsuch that the period of $f(x)$ is $a$â here. The term period would usually denote the smallest $a>0$ that fulfills $f(x+a) = f(x)$. Here you should rather just say âÂÂsuch that $f$ has a periodicity $a$âÂÂ, or âÂÂsuch that $f$ is $a$-periodicâÂÂ, which does assert $f(x+a) = f(x)$ but does not make any statement as to whether there exists also $b in ]0,a[$ with $f(x+b)=f(x)$.
â leftaroundabout
Oct 4 at 13:55
Of course you want $0<a<epsilon$
â MPW
Oct 4 at 18:07
You can construct a lot of such functions. The recipe: 1) Take any sequence $a_k$ which has infinite number of values in any neighbourhood of zero; 2) Make a set consisting of all finite sums of $a_k$ with arbitrary integer coefficients; 3) The characteristic function of this set will satisfy your requirements for $f$. If $a_k=1/k$ then you're getting rationals. If $a_k=10^-k$ then you're getting Empy2's set. If $a_k=k^-pi$ then you're getting new set which is hard to imagine :-) If $a_k=sink$ then you're getting new interesting set.
â Egor Skriptunoff
2 days ago
2
2
F(x)=1 for numbers with a halting decimal expansion, for example $3.452$ and not $1/3$
â Empy2
Oct 4 at 12:00
F(x)=1 for numbers with a halting decimal expansion, for example $3.452$ and not $1/3$
â Empy2
Oct 4 at 12:00
@Empy2 Nice: your example also works for domain $mathbbQ$.
â aschepler
Oct 4 at 12:38
@Empy2 Nice: your example also works for domain $mathbbQ$.
â aschepler
Oct 4 at 12:38
3
3
I would avoid saying âÂÂsuch that the period of $f(x)$ is $a$â here. The term period would usually denote the smallest $a>0$ that fulfills $f(x+a) = f(x)$. Here you should rather just say âÂÂsuch that $f$ has a periodicity $a$âÂÂ, or âÂÂsuch that $f$ is $a$-periodicâÂÂ, which does assert $f(x+a) = f(x)$ but does not make any statement as to whether there exists also $b in ]0,a[$ with $f(x+b)=f(x)$.
â leftaroundabout
Oct 4 at 13:55
I would avoid saying âÂÂsuch that the period of $f(x)$ is $a$â here. The term period would usually denote the smallest $a>0$ that fulfills $f(x+a) = f(x)$. Here you should rather just say âÂÂsuch that $f$ has a periodicity $a$âÂÂ, or âÂÂsuch that $f$ is $a$-periodicâÂÂ, which does assert $f(x+a) = f(x)$ but does not make any statement as to whether there exists also $b in ]0,a[$ with $f(x+b)=f(x)$.
â leftaroundabout
Oct 4 at 13:55
Of course you want $0<a<epsilon$
â MPW
Oct 4 at 18:07
Of course you want $0<a<epsilon$
â MPW
Oct 4 at 18:07
You can construct a lot of such functions. The recipe: 1) Take any sequence $a_k$ which has infinite number of values in any neighbourhood of zero; 2) Make a set consisting of all finite sums of $a_k$ with arbitrary integer coefficients; 3) The characteristic function of this set will satisfy your requirements for $f$. If $a_k=1/k$ then you're getting rationals. If $a_k=10^-k$ then you're getting Empy2's set. If $a_k=k^-pi$ then you're getting new set which is hard to imagine :-) If $a_k=sink$ then you're getting new interesting set.
â Egor Skriptunoff
2 days ago
You can construct a lot of such functions. The recipe: 1) Take any sequence $a_k$ which has infinite number of values in any neighbourhood of zero; 2) Make a set consisting of all finite sums of $a_k$ with arbitrary integer coefficients; 3) The characteristic function of this set will satisfy your requirements for $f$. If $a_k=1/k$ then you're getting rationals. If $a_k=10^-k$ then you're getting Empy2's set. If $a_k=k^-pi$ then you're getting new set which is hard to imagine :-) If $a_k=sink$ then you're getting new interesting set.
â Egor Skriptunoff
2 days ago
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You're right. The characteristic function of the rationals is periodic of period $1/n$ for all $n in mathbb N$ because $x$ is rational iff $x+1/n$ is rational.
add a comment |Â
up vote
7
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You're correct.
Let $epsilon$ be arbitrarily small. You need to prove that there exists some $0<p<epsilon$ such that $D(x)=D(x+p)$ for all $xin mathbbR$.
We know that $epsilon$ is some positive real number, so there exists some $pin mathbbQ$ such that $0<p<epsilon$. Let's look at an arbitrary $xin mathbbR$ and see if our property is satisfied or not:
If $x$ is rational, then $D(x)=1$. Since the sum of two rationals is rational, then $D(x+p)=1$ too.
If $x$ is irrational, then $D(x)=0$. Since the sum of a rational and an irrational is irrational, then $D(x+p)=0$ too.
So if we choose our period to be $p$, our property is satisfied.
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
The main question has been answered in other answers well enough, but I would like to address a few natural follow-up questions. What about continuous functions $f$ with this property?
It turns out that in this case there are no nontrivial solutions - every such function is constant. Here's a topological proof: Let $K=xinBbb Rmid forall y, f(y)=f(x+y)$ be the set of periods of $f$. If $f$ is continuous, then this is an intersection of the sets $xinBbb Rmid f(y)=f(x+y)$, which is closed (it is the preimage of $0$ under the function $g(x)=f(y)-f(x+y)$), so $K$ itself is closed. $K$ is also dense in $Bbb R$, because it is an additive group with arbitrarily small elements, so $K=Bbb R$ and hence $f(x)=f(y)$ for all $x,yin Bbb R$.
If we consider discontinuous functions again, then we know $K$ is a dense additive subgroup of $Bbb R$. Does every dense additive subgroup generate such a function? Yes, we can just take the characteristic function of $K$. For a fixed $K$, the space of such functions is just all functions $Bbb R/Kto Bbb R$. This is another way to get at the constancy result, since as a topological group, $Bbb R/K$ has the indiscrete topology, because any open set will cover $Bbb R$ if copied around with translations by $K$.
Of course $Bbb R/K$ can be uncountable, for example if $K=Bbb Q$ or any other countable subgroup. Can it be countable or finite? It can be countable assuming some choice, as observed in TomGrubb's answer. If we consider a Hamel basis $B$ of $Bbb R$ over $Bbb Q$, then the set of all real numbers with zero first projection is a subgroup $K$ of $Bbb R$ for which $Bbb R/Ksimeq Bbb Q$.
But it can't be finite (unless it is trivial). In other words, there is no coherent way to talk about real numbers being partitioned into the "even" and "odd" ones. If $Bbb R/K$ has $n>1$ elements, then that means that every number which is a multiple of $n$ is in $K$; but every real number is a multiple of $n$, to wit, $x=n(x/n)$.
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
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Another way to look at it is to think about the set of periods, i.e.
$$P = f(x + p) = f(x) text for all x in mathbbR $$
Zero is clearly a member of this set no matter what f is. P is closed under addition and negation. So clearly P is a group over addition. So, if you want to find a function that has arbitrarily small periods, you want to find a subgroup of $mathbbR$ that has arbitrarily small values. $mathbbQ$ is the obvious choice, so the characteristic function for $mathbbQ$ works, as stated in another answer.
add a comment |Â
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0
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Here's a different function with the same property (which relies on a fair bit of choice). Choose a Hamel basis for $mathbbR$ over $mathbbQ$ and pick a basis vector $v$. Let $f$ be the function which projects onto the $v$ coordinate. Then for any other basis vector $u$ and any integer $n$,
$$
f(x+u/n)=f(x).
$$
More can be found on these functions in the article "Discontinuous additive functions" by Bernardi.
Hope you don't mind my edit, since it's not that much choice needed for what you want. =)
â user21820
Oct 4 at 17:10
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5 Answers
5
active
oldest
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5 Answers
5
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
17
down vote
You're right. The characteristic function of the rationals is periodic of period $1/n$ for all $n in mathbb N$ because $x$ is rational iff $x+1/n$ is rational.
add a comment |Â
up vote
17
down vote
You're right. The characteristic function of the rationals is periodic of period $1/n$ for all $n in mathbb N$ because $x$ is rational iff $x+1/n$ is rational.
add a comment |Â
up vote
17
down vote
up vote
17
down vote
You're right. The characteristic function of the rationals is periodic of period $1/n$ for all $n in mathbb N$ because $x$ is rational iff $x+1/n$ is rational.
You're right. The characteristic function of the rationals is periodic of period $1/n$ for all $n in mathbb N$ because $x$ is rational iff $x+1/n$ is rational.
answered Oct 4 at 11:50
lhf
159k9161376
159k9161376
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up vote
7
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You're correct.
Let $epsilon$ be arbitrarily small. You need to prove that there exists some $0<p<epsilon$ such that $D(x)=D(x+p)$ for all $xin mathbbR$.
We know that $epsilon$ is some positive real number, so there exists some $pin mathbbQ$ such that $0<p<epsilon$. Let's look at an arbitrary $xin mathbbR$ and see if our property is satisfied or not:
If $x$ is rational, then $D(x)=1$. Since the sum of two rationals is rational, then $D(x+p)=1$ too.
If $x$ is irrational, then $D(x)=0$. Since the sum of a rational and an irrational is irrational, then $D(x+p)=0$ too.
So if we choose our period to be $p$, our property is satisfied.
add a comment |Â
up vote
7
down vote
You're correct.
Let $epsilon$ be arbitrarily small. You need to prove that there exists some $0<p<epsilon$ such that $D(x)=D(x+p)$ for all $xin mathbbR$.
We know that $epsilon$ is some positive real number, so there exists some $pin mathbbQ$ such that $0<p<epsilon$. Let's look at an arbitrary $xin mathbbR$ and see if our property is satisfied or not:
If $x$ is rational, then $D(x)=1$. Since the sum of two rationals is rational, then $D(x+p)=1$ too.
If $x$ is irrational, then $D(x)=0$. Since the sum of a rational and an irrational is irrational, then $D(x+p)=0$ too.
So if we choose our period to be $p$, our property is satisfied.
add a comment |Â
up vote
7
down vote
up vote
7
down vote
You're correct.
Let $epsilon$ be arbitrarily small. You need to prove that there exists some $0<p<epsilon$ such that $D(x)=D(x+p)$ for all $xin mathbbR$.
We know that $epsilon$ is some positive real number, so there exists some $pin mathbbQ$ such that $0<p<epsilon$. Let's look at an arbitrary $xin mathbbR$ and see if our property is satisfied or not:
If $x$ is rational, then $D(x)=1$. Since the sum of two rationals is rational, then $D(x+p)=1$ too.
If $x$ is irrational, then $D(x)=0$. Since the sum of a rational and an irrational is irrational, then $D(x+p)=0$ too.
So if we choose our period to be $p$, our property is satisfied.
You're correct.
Let $epsilon$ be arbitrarily small. You need to prove that there exists some $0<p<epsilon$ such that $D(x)=D(x+p)$ for all $xin mathbbR$.
We know that $epsilon$ is some positive real number, so there exists some $pin mathbbQ$ such that $0<p<epsilon$. Let's look at an arbitrary $xin mathbbR$ and see if our property is satisfied or not:
If $x$ is rational, then $D(x)=1$. Since the sum of two rationals is rational, then $D(x+p)=1$ too.
If $x$ is irrational, then $D(x)=0$. Since the sum of a rational and an irrational is irrational, then $D(x+p)=0$ too.
So if we choose our period to be $p$, our property is satisfied.
answered Oct 4 at 11:57
GSofer
469211
469211
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The main question has been answered in other answers well enough, but I would like to address a few natural follow-up questions. What about continuous functions $f$ with this property?
It turns out that in this case there are no nontrivial solutions - every such function is constant. Here's a topological proof: Let $K=xinBbb Rmid forall y, f(y)=f(x+y)$ be the set of periods of $f$. If $f$ is continuous, then this is an intersection of the sets $xinBbb Rmid f(y)=f(x+y)$, which is closed (it is the preimage of $0$ under the function $g(x)=f(y)-f(x+y)$), so $K$ itself is closed. $K$ is also dense in $Bbb R$, because it is an additive group with arbitrarily small elements, so $K=Bbb R$ and hence $f(x)=f(y)$ for all $x,yin Bbb R$.
If we consider discontinuous functions again, then we know $K$ is a dense additive subgroup of $Bbb R$. Does every dense additive subgroup generate such a function? Yes, we can just take the characteristic function of $K$. For a fixed $K$, the space of such functions is just all functions $Bbb R/Kto Bbb R$. This is another way to get at the constancy result, since as a topological group, $Bbb R/K$ has the indiscrete topology, because any open set will cover $Bbb R$ if copied around with translations by $K$.
Of course $Bbb R/K$ can be uncountable, for example if $K=Bbb Q$ or any other countable subgroup. Can it be countable or finite? It can be countable assuming some choice, as observed in TomGrubb's answer. If we consider a Hamel basis $B$ of $Bbb R$ over $Bbb Q$, then the set of all real numbers with zero first projection is a subgroup $K$ of $Bbb R$ for which $Bbb R/Ksimeq Bbb Q$.
But it can't be finite (unless it is trivial). In other words, there is no coherent way to talk about real numbers being partitioned into the "even" and "odd" ones. If $Bbb R/K$ has $n>1$ elements, then that means that every number which is a multiple of $n$ is in $K$; but every real number is a multiple of $n$, to wit, $x=n(x/n)$.
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
The main question has been answered in other answers well enough, but I would like to address a few natural follow-up questions. What about continuous functions $f$ with this property?
It turns out that in this case there are no nontrivial solutions - every such function is constant. Here's a topological proof: Let $K=xinBbb Rmid forall y, f(y)=f(x+y)$ be the set of periods of $f$. If $f$ is continuous, then this is an intersection of the sets $xinBbb Rmid f(y)=f(x+y)$, which is closed (it is the preimage of $0$ under the function $g(x)=f(y)-f(x+y)$), so $K$ itself is closed. $K$ is also dense in $Bbb R$, because it is an additive group with arbitrarily small elements, so $K=Bbb R$ and hence $f(x)=f(y)$ for all $x,yin Bbb R$.
If we consider discontinuous functions again, then we know $K$ is a dense additive subgroup of $Bbb R$. Does every dense additive subgroup generate such a function? Yes, we can just take the characteristic function of $K$. For a fixed $K$, the space of such functions is just all functions $Bbb R/Kto Bbb R$. This is another way to get at the constancy result, since as a topological group, $Bbb R/K$ has the indiscrete topology, because any open set will cover $Bbb R$ if copied around with translations by $K$.
Of course $Bbb R/K$ can be uncountable, for example if $K=Bbb Q$ or any other countable subgroup. Can it be countable or finite? It can be countable assuming some choice, as observed in TomGrubb's answer. If we consider a Hamel basis $B$ of $Bbb R$ over $Bbb Q$, then the set of all real numbers with zero first projection is a subgroup $K$ of $Bbb R$ for which $Bbb R/Ksimeq Bbb Q$.
But it can't be finite (unless it is trivial). In other words, there is no coherent way to talk about real numbers being partitioned into the "even" and "odd" ones. If $Bbb R/K$ has $n>1$ elements, then that means that every number which is a multiple of $n$ is in $K$; but every real number is a multiple of $n$, to wit, $x=n(x/n)$.
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
up vote
3
down vote
The main question has been answered in other answers well enough, but I would like to address a few natural follow-up questions. What about continuous functions $f$ with this property?
It turns out that in this case there are no nontrivial solutions - every such function is constant. Here's a topological proof: Let $K=xinBbb Rmid forall y, f(y)=f(x+y)$ be the set of periods of $f$. If $f$ is continuous, then this is an intersection of the sets $xinBbb Rmid f(y)=f(x+y)$, which is closed (it is the preimage of $0$ under the function $g(x)=f(y)-f(x+y)$), so $K$ itself is closed. $K$ is also dense in $Bbb R$, because it is an additive group with arbitrarily small elements, so $K=Bbb R$ and hence $f(x)=f(y)$ for all $x,yin Bbb R$.
If we consider discontinuous functions again, then we know $K$ is a dense additive subgroup of $Bbb R$. Does every dense additive subgroup generate such a function? Yes, we can just take the characteristic function of $K$. For a fixed $K$, the space of such functions is just all functions $Bbb R/Kto Bbb R$. This is another way to get at the constancy result, since as a topological group, $Bbb R/K$ has the indiscrete topology, because any open set will cover $Bbb R$ if copied around with translations by $K$.
Of course $Bbb R/K$ can be uncountable, for example if $K=Bbb Q$ or any other countable subgroup. Can it be countable or finite? It can be countable assuming some choice, as observed in TomGrubb's answer. If we consider a Hamel basis $B$ of $Bbb R$ over $Bbb Q$, then the set of all real numbers with zero first projection is a subgroup $K$ of $Bbb R$ for which $Bbb R/Ksimeq Bbb Q$.
But it can't be finite (unless it is trivial). In other words, there is no coherent way to talk about real numbers being partitioned into the "even" and "odd" ones. If $Bbb R/K$ has $n>1$ elements, then that means that every number which is a multiple of $n$ is in $K$; but every real number is a multiple of $n$, to wit, $x=n(x/n)$.
The main question has been answered in other answers well enough, but I would like to address a few natural follow-up questions. What about continuous functions $f$ with this property?
It turns out that in this case there are no nontrivial solutions - every such function is constant. Here's a topological proof: Let $K=xinBbb Rmid forall y, f(y)=f(x+y)$ be the set of periods of $f$. If $f$ is continuous, then this is an intersection of the sets $xinBbb Rmid f(y)=f(x+y)$, which is closed (it is the preimage of $0$ under the function $g(x)=f(y)-f(x+y)$), so $K$ itself is closed. $K$ is also dense in $Bbb R$, because it is an additive group with arbitrarily small elements, so $K=Bbb R$ and hence $f(x)=f(y)$ for all $x,yin Bbb R$.
If we consider discontinuous functions again, then we know $K$ is a dense additive subgroup of $Bbb R$. Does every dense additive subgroup generate such a function? Yes, we can just take the characteristic function of $K$. For a fixed $K$, the space of such functions is just all functions $Bbb R/Kto Bbb R$. This is another way to get at the constancy result, since as a topological group, $Bbb R/K$ has the indiscrete topology, because any open set will cover $Bbb R$ if copied around with translations by $K$.
Of course $Bbb R/K$ can be uncountable, for example if $K=Bbb Q$ or any other countable subgroup. Can it be countable or finite? It can be countable assuming some choice, as observed in TomGrubb's answer. If we consider a Hamel basis $B$ of $Bbb R$ over $Bbb Q$, then the set of all real numbers with zero first projection is a subgroup $K$ of $Bbb R$ for which $Bbb R/Ksimeq Bbb Q$.
But it can't be finite (unless it is trivial). In other words, there is no coherent way to talk about real numbers being partitioned into the "even" and "odd" ones. If $Bbb R/K$ has $n>1$ elements, then that means that every number which is a multiple of $n$ is in $K$; but every real number is a multiple of $n$, to wit, $x=n(x/n)$.
answered Oct 4 at 21:08
Mario Carneiro
18.2k33888
18.2k33888
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Another way to look at it is to think about the set of periods, i.e.
$$P = f(x + p) = f(x) text for all x in mathbbR $$
Zero is clearly a member of this set no matter what f is. P is closed under addition and negation. So clearly P is a group over addition. So, if you want to find a function that has arbitrarily small periods, you want to find a subgroup of $mathbbR$ that has arbitrarily small values. $mathbbQ$ is the obvious choice, so the characteristic function for $mathbbQ$ works, as stated in another answer.
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
Another way to look at it is to think about the set of periods, i.e.
$$P = f(x + p) = f(x) text for all x in mathbbR $$
Zero is clearly a member of this set no matter what f is. P is closed under addition and negation. So clearly P is a group over addition. So, if you want to find a function that has arbitrarily small periods, you want to find a subgroup of $mathbbR$ that has arbitrarily small values. $mathbbQ$ is the obvious choice, so the characteristic function for $mathbbQ$ works, as stated in another answer.
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
up vote
3
down vote
Another way to look at it is to think about the set of periods, i.e.
$$P = f(x + p) = f(x) text for all x in mathbbR $$
Zero is clearly a member of this set no matter what f is. P is closed under addition and negation. So clearly P is a group over addition. So, if you want to find a function that has arbitrarily small periods, you want to find a subgroup of $mathbbR$ that has arbitrarily small values. $mathbbQ$ is the obvious choice, so the characteristic function for $mathbbQ$ works, as stated in another answer.
Another way to look at it is to think about the set of periods, i.e.
$$P = f(x + p) = f(x) text for all x in mathbbR $$
Zero is clearly a member of this set no matter what f is. P is closed under addition and negation. So clearly P is a group over addition. So, if you want to find a function that has arbitrarily small periods, you want to find a subgroup of $mathbbR$ that has arbitrarily small values. $mathbbQ$ is the obvious choice, so the characteristic function for $mathbbQ$ works, as stated in another answer.
edited 2 days ago
Yanko
4,217720
4,217720
answered Oct 4 at 15:01
David Stanley
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0
down vote
Here's a different function with the same property (which relies on a fair bit of choice). Choose a Hamel basis for $mathbbR$ over $mathbbQ$ and pick a basis vector $v$. Let $f$ be the function which projects onto the $v$ coordinate. Then for any other basis vector $u$ and any integer $n$,
$$
f(x+u/n)=f(x).
$$
More can be found on these functions in the article "Discontinuous additive functions" by Bernardi.
Hope you don't mind my edit, since it's not that much choice needed for what you want. =)
â user21820
Oct 4 at 17:10
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
Here's a different function with the same property (which relies on a fair bit of choice). Choose a Hamel basis for $mathbbR$ over $mathbbQ$ and pick a basis vector $v$. Let $f$ be the function which projects onto the $v$ coordinate. Then for any other basis vector $u$ and any integer $n$,
$$
f(x+u/n)=f(x).
$$
More can be found on these functions in the article "Discontinuous additive functions" by Bernardi.
Hope you don't mind my edit, since it's not that much choice needed for what you want. =)
â user21820
Oct 4 at 17:10
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
up vote
0
down vote
Here's a different function with the same property (which relies on a fair bit of choice). Choose a Hamel basis for $mathbbR$ over $mathbbQ$ and pick a basis vector $v$. Let $f$ be the function which projects onto the $v$ coordinate. Then for any other basis vector $u$ and any integer $n$,
$$
f(x+u/n)=f(x).
$$
More can be found on these functions in the article "Discontinuous additive functions" by Bernardi.
Here's a different function with the same property (which relies on a fair bit of choice). Choose a Hamel basis for $mathbbR$ over $mathbbQ$ and pick a basis vector $v$. Let $f$ be the function which projects onto the $v$ coordinate. Then for any other basis vector $u$ and any integer $n$,
$$
f(x+u/n)=f(x).
$$
More can be found on these functions in the article "Discontinuous additive functions" by Bernardi.
edited Oct 4 at 17:10
user21820
36.8k441143
36.8k441143
answered Oct 4 at 13:46
TomGrubb
10.6k11438
10.6k11438
Hope you don't mind my edit, since it's not that much choice needed for what you want. =)
â user21820
Oct 4 at 17:10
add a comment |Â
Hope you don't mind my edit, since it's not that much choice needed for what you want. =)
â user21820
Oct 4 at 17:10
Hope you don't mind my edit, since it's not that much choice needed for what you want. =)
â user21820
Oct 4 at 17:10
Hope you don't mind my edit, since it's not that much choice needed for what you want. =)
â user21820
Oct 4 at 17:10
add a comment |Â
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2
F(x)=1 for numbers with a halting decimal expansion, for example $3.452$ and not $1/3$
â Empy2
Oct 4 at 12:00
@Empy2 Nice: your example also works for domain $mathbbQ$.
â aschepler
Oct 4 at 12:38
3
I would avoid saying âÂÂsuch that the period of $f(x)$ is $a$â here. The term period would usually denote the smallest $a>0$ that fulfills $f(x+a) = f(x)$. Here you should rather just say âÂÂsuch that $f$ has a periodicity $a$âÂÂ, or âÂÂsuch that $f$ is $a$-periodicâÂÂ, which does assert $f(x+a) = f(x)$ but does not make any statement as to whether there exists also $b in ]0,a[$ with $f(x+b)=f(x)$.
â leftaroundabout
Oct 4 at 13:55
Of course you want $0<a<epsilon$
â MPW
Oct 4 at 18:07
You can construct a lot of such functions. The recipe: 1) Take any sequence $a_k$ which has infinite number of values in any neighbourhood of zero; 2) Make a set consisting of all finite sums of $a_k$ with arbitrary integer coefficients; 3) The characteristic function of this set will satisfy your requirements for $f$. If $a_k=1/k$ then you're getting rationals. If $a_k=10^-k$ then you're getting Empy2's set. If $a_k=k^-pi$ then you're getting new set which is hard to imagine :-) If $a_k=sink$ then you're getting new interesting set.
â Egor Skriptunoff
2 days ago