How does Compelled Duel work with the saving throws?
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The level 1 spell, Compelled Duel:
Compel a creature you can see to duel you. Unless they succeed on a Wisdom saving throw, the target is only able to attack someone other than you with disadvantage and they must succeed on a Wisdom saving throw to move more than 30 feet from you. They only have to succeed at the saving throw once in order to move freely for the rest of their turn.
If you try to harm any creature besides the target, if a friendly creature tries to harm the target, or if you end your turn more than 30 feet away from the target, the spell ends.
Assuming I read this correctly, the spell itself automatically succeeds in any scenario, but the individual effects may fail on a per-event basis.
So even if my target succeeds on their check, as long as I am within 30 feet of them when I end my next turn, and my concentration isn't broken, they have to resist the same saving throws every single round? Or am I reading this incorrectly?
Read as:
- No saving throw at start
- Requires a saving throw for every attempt to hit someone else without disadvantage
- Requires a saving throw for every attempt to move more than 30 feet away from me.
But it plausibly could be:
- Requires a saving throw at start
- Initial saving throw determines whether the target can attack others without disadvantage
- Moving away further than 30 feet still requires a per/turn saving throw
And as @NepeneNep has mentioned, it's plausible that the spell is intended for the saving throw on the attack to nullify the need for a saving throw on the movement, due to the line "They only have to succeed at the saving throw once in order to move.", where I interpret that line as being added to prevent a creature from having to make a saving throw for every attempt to move away in the same turn (so they don't have to roll for every 5 feet).
So which is it?
dnd-5e spells saving-throw
edited Aug 23 at 19:35
V2Blast
15.1k23598
asked Aug 23 at 15:37
Daniel Zastoupil
4,9761155
add a comment |Â
up vote
5
down vote
favorite
The level 1 spell, Compelled Duel:
Compel a creature you can see to duel you. Unless they succeed on a Wisdom saving throw, the target is only able to attack someone other than you with disadvantage and they must succeed on a Wisdom saving throw to move more than 30 feet from you. They only have to succeed at the saving throw once in order to move freely for the rest of their turn.
If you try to harm any creature besides the target, if a friendly creature tries to harm the target, or if you end your turn more than 30 feet away from the target, the spell ends.
Assuming I read this correctly, the spell itself automatically succeeds in any scenario, but the individual effects may fail on a per-event basis.
So even if my target succeeds on their check, as long as I am within 30 feet of them when I end my next turn, and my concentration isn't broken, they have to resist the same saving throws every single round? Or am I reading this incorrectly?
Read as:
- No saving throw at start
- Requires a saving throw for every attempt to hit someone else without disadvantage
- Requires a saving throw for every attempt to move more than 30 feet away from me.
But it plausibly could be:
- Requires a saving throw at start
- Initial saving throw determines whether the target can attack others without disadvantage
- Moving away further than 30 feet still requires a per/turn saving throw
And as @NepeneNep has mentioned, it's plausible that the spell is intended for the saving throw on the attack to nullify the need for a saving throw on the movement, due to the line "They only have to succeed at the saving throw once in order to move.", where I interpret that line as being added to prevent a creature from having to make a saving throw for every attempt to move away in the same turn (so they don't have to roll for every 5 feet).
So which is it?
dnd-5e spells saving-throw
edited Aug 23 at 19:35
V2Blast
15.1k23598
asked Aug 23 at 15:37
Daniel Zastoupil
4,9761155
1
In the future, you don't have to indicate Edits. Simply add what you need to. This isn't a forum, people are going to look at everything you post when considering answering/answers. Additionally, there's no need to apologize for missing some writing. Probably 70% (by my estimates) of questions on this site are "am I reading this correctly" or "did I miss any writing about this". There are a lot of words in a lot of locations, and its easy to miss something like this.
– Ifusaso
Aug 23 at 17:48
Sourcing quotes (or simply in-line linking) is also a good way to elicit good answers and allow people to catch things like Xirema did.
– Ifusaso
Aug 23 at 17:49
@Ifusaso I added the Edit to avoid devaluing Xirema's response. If I edited in the correct information, Xirema's answer holds no information, but at the same time, my original question was incorrect to ask and needed to be fixed to prevent others taking my words as truth. Adding in an indicated edit explained both that my question was wrong without undermining Xirema's addition.
– Daniel Zastoupil
Aug 23 at 17:51
1
@DanielZastoupil: There's no real need to indicate the source of your confusion in the post itself; you can simply leave that as a comment on the accepted answer. (Though the act of accepting the answer itself already kind of indicates that.)
– V2Blast
Aug 23 at 19:34
add a comment |Â
up vote
5
down vote
favorite
up vote
5
down vote
favorite
The level 1 spell, Compelled Duel:
Compel a creature you can see to duel you. Unless they succeed on a Wisdom saving throw, the target is only able to attack someone other than you with disadvantage and they must succeed on a Wisdom saving throw to move more than 30 feet from you. They only have to succeed at the saving throw once in order to move freely for the rest of their turn.
If you try to harm any creature besides the target, if a friendly creature tries to harm the target, or if you end your turn more than 30 feet away from the target, the spell ends.
Assuming I read this correctly, the spell itself automatically succeeds in any scenario, but the individual effects may fail on a per-event basis.
So even if my target succeeds on their check, as long as I am within 30 feet of them when I end my next turn, and my concentration isn't broken, they have to resist the same saving throws every single round? Or am I reading this incorrectly?
Read as:
- No saving throw at start
- Requires a saving throw for every attempt to hit someone else without disadvantage
- Requires a saving throw for every attempt to move more than 30 feet away from me.
But it plausibly could be:
- Requires a saving throw at start
- Initial saving throw determines whether the target can attack others without disadvantage
- Moving away further than 30 feet still requires a per/turn saving throw
And as @NepeneNep has mentioned, it's plausible that the spell is intended for the saving throw on the attack to nullify the need for a saving throw on the movement, due to the line "They only have to succeed at the saving throw once in order to move.", where I interpret that line as being added to prevent a creature from having to make a saving throw for every attempt to move away in the same turn (so they don't have to roll for every 5 feet).
So which is it?
dnd-5e spells saving-throw
edited Aug 23 at 19:35
V2Blast
15.1k23598
asked Aug 23 at 15:37
Daniel Zastoupil
4,9761155
The level 1 spell, Compelled Duel:
Compel a creature you can see to duel you. Unless they succeed on a Wisdom saving throw, the target is only able to attack someone other than you with disadvantage and they must succeed on a Wisdom saving throw to move more than 30 feet from you. They only have to succeed at the saving throw once in order to move freely for the rest of their turn.
If you try to harm any creature besides the target, if a friendly creature tries to harm the target, or if you end your turn more than 30 feet away from the target, the spell ends.
Assuming I read this correctly, the spell itself automatically succeeds in any scenario, but the individual effects may fail on a per-event basis.
So even if my target succeeds on their check, as long as I am within 30 feet of them when I end my next turn, and my concentration isn't broken, they have to resist the same saving throws every single round? Or am I reading this incorrectly?
Read as:
- No saving throw at start
- Requires a saving throw for every attempt to hit someone else without disadvantage
- Requires a saving throw for every attempt to move more than 30 feet away from me.
But it plausibly could be:
- Requires a saving throw at start
- Initial saving throw determines whether the target can attack others without disadvantage
- Moving away further than 30 feet still requires a per/turn saving throw
And as @NepeneNep has mentioned, it's plausible that the spell is intended for the saving throw on the attack to nullify the need for a saving throw on the movement, due to the line "They only have to succeed at the saving throw once in order to move.", where I interpret that line as being added to prevent a creature from having to make a saving throw for every attempt to move away in the same turn (so they don't have to roll for every 5 feet).
So which is it?
dnd-5e spells saving-throw
dnd-5e spells saving-throw
edited Aug 23 at 19:35
V2Blast
15.1k23598
asked Aug 23 at 15:37
Daniel Zastoupil
4,9761155
edited Aug 23 at 19:35
V2Blast
15.1k23598
asked Aug 23 at 15:37
Daniel Zastoupil
4,9761155
edited Aug 23 at 19:35
V2Blast
15.1k23598
edited Aug 23 at 19:35
V2Blast
15.1k23598
edited Aug 23 at 19:35
V2Blast
15.1k23598
15.1k23598
asked Aug 23 at 15:37
Daniel Zastoupil
4,9761155
asked Aug 23 at 15:37
Daniel Zastoupil
4,9761155
asked Aug 23 at 15:37
Daniel Zastoupil
4,9761155
4,9761155
1
In the future, you don't have to indicate Edits. Simply add what you need to. This isn't a forum, people are going to look at everything you post when considering answering/answers. Additionally, there's no need to apologize for missing some writing. Probably 70% (by my estimates) of questions on this site are "am I reading this correctly" or "did I miss any writing about this". There are a lot of words in a lot of locations, and its easy to miss something like this.
– Ifusaso
Aug 23 at 17:48
Sourcing quotes (or simply in-line linking) is also a good way to elicit good answers and allow people to catch things like Xirema did.
– Ifusaso
Aug 23 at 17:49
@Ifusaso I added the Edit to avoid devaluing Xirema's response. If I edited in the correct information, Xirema's answer holds no information, but at the same time, my original question was incorrect to ask and needed to be fixed to prevent others taking my words as truth. Adding in an indicated edit explained both that my question was wrong without undermining Xirema's addition.
– Daniel Zastoupil
Aug 23 at 17:51
1
@DanielZastoupil: There's no real need to indicate the source of your confusion in the post itself; you can simply leave that as a comment on the accepted answer. (Though the act of accepting the answer itself already kind of indicates that.)
– V2Blast
Aug 23 at 19:34
add a comment |Â
1
In the future, you don't have to indicate Edits. Simply add what you need to. This isn't a forum, people are going to look at everything you post when considering answering/answers. Additionally, there's no need to apologize for missing some writing. Probably 70% (by my estimates) of questions on this site are "am I reading this correctly" or "did I miss any writing about this". There are a lot of words in a lot of locations, and its easy to miss something like this.
– Ifusaso
Aug 23 at 17:48
Sourcing quotes (or simply in-line linking) is also a good way to elicit good answers and allow people to catch things like Xirema did.
– Ifusaso
Aug 23 at 17:49
@Ifusaso I added the Edit to avoid devaluing Xirema's response. If I edited in the correct information, Xirema's answer holds no information, but at the same time, my original question was incorrect to ask and needed to be fixed to prevent others taking my words as truth. Adding in an indicated edit explained both that my question was wrong without undermining Xirema's addition.
– Daniel Zastoupil
Aug 23 at 17:51
1
@DanielZastoupil: There's no real need to indicate the source of your confusion in the post itself; you can simply leave that as a comment on the accepted answer. (Though the act of accepting the answer itself already kind of indicates that.)
– V2Blast
Aug 23 at 19:34
1
1
In the future, you don't have to indicate Edits. Simply add what you need to. This isn't a forum, people are going to look at everything you post when considering answering/answers. Additionally, there's no need to apologize for missing some writing. Probably 70% (by my estimates) of questions on this site are "am I reading this correctly" or "did I miss any writing about this". There are a lot of words in a lot of locations, and its easy to miss something like this.
– Ifusaso
Aug 23 at 17:48
In the future, you don't have to indicate Edits. Simply add what you need to. This isn't a forum, people are going to look at everything you post when considering answering/answers. Additionally, there's no need to apologize for missing some writing. Probably 70% (by my estimates) of questions on this site are "am I reading this correctly" or "did I miss any writing about this". There are a lot of words in a lot of locations, and its easy to miss something like this.
– Ifusaso
Aug 23 at 17:48
Sourcing quotes (or simply in-line linking) is also a good way to elicit good answers and allow people to catch things like Xirema did.
– Ifusaso
Aug 23 at 17:49
Sourcing quotes (or simply in-line linking) is also a good way to elicit good answers and allow people to catch things like Xirema did.
– Ifusaso
Aug 23 at 17:49
@Ifusaso I added the Edit to avoid devaluing Xirema's response. If I edited in the correct information, Xirema's answer holds no information, but at the same time, my original question was incorrect to ask and needed to be fixed to prevent others taking my words as truth. Adding in an indicated edit explained both that my question was wrong without undermining Xirema's addition.
– Daniel Zastoupil
Aug 23 at 17:51
@Ifusaso I added the Edit to avoid devaluing Xirema's response. If I edited in the correct information, Xirema's answer holds no information, but at the same time, my original question was incorrect to ask and needed to be fixed to prevent others taking my words as truth. Adding in an indicated edit explained both that my question was wrong without undermining Xirema's addition.
– Daniel Zastoupil
Aug 23 at 17:51
1
1
@DanielZastoupil: There's no real need to indicate the source of your confusion in the post itself; you can simply leave that as a comment on the accepted answer. (Though the act of accepting the answer itself already kind of indicates that.)
– V2Blast
Aug 23 at 19:34
@DanielZastoupil: There's no real need to indicate the source of your confusion in the post itself; you can simply leave that as a comment on the accepted answer. (Though the act of accepting the answer itself already kind of indicates that.)
– V2Blast
Aug 23 at 19:34
add a comment |Â
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
up vote
11
down vote
accepted
The description you've provided for the spell doesn't match the description provided by the Player's Handbook. This is how the compelled duel spell description appears in there:
You attempt to compel a creature into a duel. One creature that you can see within range must make a Wisdom saving throw. On a failed save, the creature is drawn to you, compelled by your divine demand. For the duration, it has disadvantage on attack rolls against creatures other than you, and must make a Wisdom saving throw each time it attempts to move to a space that is more than 30 feet away from you; if it succeeds on this saving throw, this spell doesn't restrict the target's movement for that turn.
The spell ends if you attack any other creature, if you cast a spell that targets a hostile creature other than the target, if a creature friendly to you damages the target or casts a harmful spell on it, or if you end your turn more than 30 feet away from the target.
—PHB, pg 224
The PHB version of the description makes it clear that the second version you've described, where there's an initial saving throw + saving throws for the movement is what's meant to apply. The description you provided seems to come from the 5e Wikia page, which doesn't source its description, and in paraphrasing the spell's effect, accidentally leaves the semantics of the spell ambiguous.
edited Aug 23 at 19:33
V2Blast
15.1k23598
answered Aug 23 at 15:51
Xirema
5,9801743
What happens if the creature succeeds the initial saving throw, but the spell doesn't end?
– Daniel Zastoupil
Aug 23 at 15:55
3
@DanielZastoupil If they succeed at the initial saving throw, the spell ends immediately, as is the case for most duration based spells that have an initial saving throw.
– Xirema
Aug 23 at 15:57
add a comment |Â
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
11
down vote
accepted
The description you've provided for the spell doesn't match the description provided by the Player's Handbook. This is how the compelled duel spell description appears in there:
You attempt to compel a creature into a duel. One creature that you can see within range must make a Wisdom saving throw. On a failed save, the creature is drawn to you, compelled by your divine demand. For the duration, it has disadvantage on attack rolls against creatures other than you, and must make a Wisdom saving throw each time it attempts to move to a space that is more than 30 feet away from you; if it succeeds on this saving throw, this spell doesn't restrict the target's movement for that turn.
The spell ends if you attack any other creature, if you cast a spell that targets a hostile creature other than the target, if a creature friendly to you damages the target or casts a harmful spell on it, or if you end your turn more than 30 feet away from the target.
—PHB, pg 224
The PHB version of the description makes it clear that the second version you've described, where there's an initial saving throw + saving throws for the movement is what's meant to apply. The description you provided seems to come from the 5e Wikia page, which doesn't source its description, and in paraphrasing the spell's effect, accidentally leaves the semantics of the spell ambiguous.
edited Aug 23 at 19:33
V2Blast
15.1k23598
answered Aug 23 at 15:51
Xirema
5,9801743
What happens if the creature succeeds the initial saving throw, but the spell doesn't end?
– Daniel Zastoupil
Aug 23 at 15:55
3
@DanielZastoupil If they succeed at the initial saving throw, the spell ends immediately, as is the case for most duration based spells that have an initial saving throw.
– Xirema
Aug 23 at 15:57
add a comment |Â
up vote
11
down vote
accepted
The description you've provided for the spell doesn't match the description provided by the Player's Handbook. This is how the compelled duel spell description appears in there:
You attempt to compel a creature into a duel. One creature that you can see within range must make a Wisdom saving throw. On a failed save, the creature is drawn to you, compelled by your divine demand. For the duration, it has disadvantage on attack rolls against creatures other than you, and must make a Wisdom saving throw each time it attempts to move to a space that is more than 30 feet away from you; if it succeeds on this saving throw, this spell doesn't restrict the target's movement for that turn.
The spell ends if you attack any other creature, if you cast a spell that targets a hostile creature other than the target, if a creature friendly to you damages the target or casts a harmful spell on it, or if you end your turn more than 30 feet away from the target.
—PHB, pg 224
The PHB version of the description makes it clear that the second version you've described, where there's an initial saving throw + saving throws for the movement is what's meant to apply. The description you provided seems to come from the 5e Wikia page, which doesn't source its description, and in paraphrasing the spell's effect, accidentally leaves the semantics of the spell ambiguous.
edited Aug 23 at 19:33
V2Blast
15.1k23598
answered Aug 23 at 15:51
Xirema
5,9801743
What happens if the creature succeeds the initial saving throw, but the spell doesn't end?
– Daniel Zastoupil
Aug 23 at 15:55
3
@DanielZastoupil If they succeed at the initial saving throw, the spell ends immediately, as is the case for most duration based spells that have an initial saving throw.
– Xirema
Aug 23 at 15:57
add a comment |Â
up vote
11
down vote
accepted
up vote
11
down vote
accepted
The description you've provided for the spell doesn't match the description provided by the Player's Handbook. This is how the compelled duel spell description appears in there:
You attempt to compel a creature into a duel. One creature that you can see within range must make a Wisdom saving throw. On a failed save, the creature is drawn to you, compelled by your divine demand. For the duration, it has disadvantage on attack rolls against creatures other than you, and must make a Wisdom saving throw each time it attempts to move to a space that is more than 30 feet away from you; if it succeeds on this saving throw, this spell doesn't restrict the target's movement for that turn.
The spell ends if you attack any other creature, if you cast a spell that targets a hostile creature other than the target, if a creature friendly to you damages the target or casts a harmful spell on it, or if you end your turn more than 30 feet away from the target.
—PHB, pg 224
The PHB version of the description makes it clear that the second version you've described, where there's an initial saving throw + saving throws for the movement is what's meant to apply. The description you provided seems to come from the 5e Wikia page, which doesn't source its description, and in paraphrasing the spell's effect, accidentally leaves the semantics of the spell ambiguous.
edited Aug 23 at 19:33
V2Blast
15.1k23598
answered Aug 23 at 15:51
Xirema
5,9801743
The description you've provided for the spell doesn't match the description provided by the Player's Handbook. This is how the compelled duel spell description appears in there:
You attempt to compel a creature into a duel. One creature that you can see within range must make a Wisdom saving throw. On a failed save, the creature is drawn to you, compelled by your divine demand. For the duration, it has disadvantage on attack rolls against creatures other than you, and must make a Wisdom saving throw each time it attempts to move to a space that is more than 30 feet away from you; if it succeeds on this saving throw, this spell doesn't restrict the target's movement for that turn.
The spell ends if you attack any other creature, if you cast a spell that targets a hostile creature other than the target, if a creature friendly to you damages the target or casts a harmful spell on it, or if you end your turn more than 30 feet away from the target.
—PHB, pg 224
The PHB version of the description makes it clear that the second version you've described, where there's an initial saving throw + saving throws for the movement is what's meant to apply. The description you provided seems to come from the 5e Wikia page, which doesn't source its description, and in paraphrasing the spell's effect, accidentally leaves the semantics of the spell ambiguous.
edited Aug 23 at 19:33
V2Blast
15.1k23598
answered Aug 23 at 15:51
Xirema
5,9801743
edited Aug 23 at 19:33
V2Blast
15.1k23598
edited Aug 23 at 19:33
V2Blast
15.1k23598
edited Aug 23 at 19:33
V2Blast
15.1k23598
15.1k23598
answered Aug 23 at 15:51
Xirema
5,9801743
answered Aug 23 at 15:51
Xirema
5,9801743
answered Aug 23 at 15:51
Xirema
5,9801743
5,9801743
What happens if the creature succeeds the initial saving throw, but the spell doesn't end?
– Daniel Zastoupil
Aug 23 at 15:55
3
@DanielZastoupil If they succeed at the initial saving throw, the spell ends immediately, as is the case for most duration based spells that have an initial saving throw.
– Xirema
Aug 23 at 15:57
add a comment |Â
What happens if the creature succeeds the initial saving throw, but the spell doesn't end?
– Daniel Zastoupil
Aug 23 at 15:55
3
@DanielZastoupil If they succeed at the initial saving throw, the spell ends immediately, as is the case for most duration based spells that have an initial saving throw.
– Xirema
Aug 23 at 15:57
What happens if the creature succeeds the initial saving throw, but the spell doesn't end?
– Daniel Zastoupil
Aug 23 at 15:55
What happens if the creature succeeds the initial saving throw, but the spell doesn't end?
– Daniel Zastoupil
Aug 23 at 15:55
3
3
@DanielZastoupil If they succeed at the initial saving throw, the spell ends immediately, as is the case for most duration based spells that have an initial saving throw.
– Xirema
Aug 23 at 15:57
@DanielZastoupil If they succeed at the initial saving throw, the spell ends immediately, as is the case for most duration based spells that have an initial saving throw.
– Xirema
Aug 23 at 15:57
add a comment |Â
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1
In the future, you don't have to indicate Edits. Simply add what you need to. This isn't a forum, people are going to look at everything you post when considering answering/answers. Additionally, there's no need to apologize for missing some writing. Probably 70% (by my estimates) of questions on this site are "am I reading this correctly" or "did I miss any writing about this". There are a lot of words in a lot of locations, and its easy to miss something like this.
– Ifusaso
Aug 23 at 17:48
Sourcing quotes (or simply in-line linking) is also a good way to elicit good answers and allow people to catch things like Xirema did.
– Ifusaso
Aug 23 at 17:49
@Ifusaso I added the Edit to avoid devaluing Xirema's response. If I edited in the correct information, Xirema's answer holds no information, but at the same time, my original question was incorrect to ask and needed to be fixed to prevent others taking my words as truth. Adding in an indicated edit explained both that my question was wrong without undermining Xirema's addition.
– Daniel Zastoupil
Aug 23 at 17:51
1
@DanielZastoupil: There's no real need to indicate the source of your confusion in the post itself; you can simply leave that as a comment on the accepted answer. (Though the act of accepting the answer itself already kind of indicates that.)
– V2Blast
Aug 23 at 19:34