Is there any other number that has similar properties as $21$?

The name of the pictureThe name of the pictureThe name of the pictureClash Royale CLAN TAG#URR8PPP












36












$begingroup$


It's my observation.



Let
$$n=p_1×p_2×p_3×dots×p_r$$
where $p_i$ are prime factors and
$f$ and $g$ are the functions
$$f(n)=1+2+dots+n$$
And
$$g(n)=p_1+p_2+dots+p_r$$
If we put $n=21$ then
$$g(f(21))=g(231)=21.$$
I checked it upto $n=10000$, I did not find another number with this property $g(f(n))=n$.



Can we prove that other such numbers do not exist?










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$











  • $begingroup$
    To clarify, is $g(12)=5$ or $=7$?
    $endgroup$
    – Hagen von Eitzen
    Mar 1 at 7:22










  • $begingroup$
    12=3*2*2 then g(12)=2+2+3=7
    $endgroup$
    – Pruthviraj Hajari
    Mar 1 at 7:35







  • 2




    $begingroup$
    @PruthvirajHajari Did you come up with this problem by yourself? If so, please state that in your question and include the program code used to run it.
    $endgroup$
    – TheSimpliFire
    Mar 1 at 7:47










  • $begingroup$
    I encourage you to accept my answer by clicking the tick you see beside it.
    $endgroup$
    – Parcly Taxel
    Mar 1 at 13:37






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @PruthvirajHajari sure it is.
    $endgroup$
    – Parcly Taxel
    Mar 1 at 14:01















36












$begingroup$


It's my observation.



Let
$$n=p_1×p_2×p_3×dots×p_r$$
where $p_i$ are prime factors and
$f$ and $g$ are the functions
$$f(n)=1+2+dots+n$$
And
$$g(n)=p_1+p_2+dots+p_r$$
If we put $n=21$ then
$$g(f(21))=g(231)=21.$$
I checked it upto $n=10000$, I did not find another number with this property $g(f(n))=n$.



Can we prove that other such numbers do not exist?










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$











  • $begingroup$
    To clarify, is $g(12)=5$ or $=7$?
    $endgroup$
    – Hagen von Eitzen
    Mar 1 at 7:22










  • $begingroup$
    12=3*2*2 then g(12)=2+2+3=7
    $endgroup$
    – Pruthviraj Hajari
    Mar 1 at 7:35







  • 2




    $begingroup$
    @PruthvirajHajari Did you come up with this problem by yourself? If so, please state that in your question and include the program code used to run it.
    $endgroup$
    – TheSimpliFire
    Mar 1 at 7:47










  • $begingroup$
    I encourage you to accept my answer by clicking the tick you see beside it.
    $endgroup$
    – Parcly Taxel
    Mar 1 at 13:37






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @PruthvirajHajari sure it is.
    $endgroup$
    – Parcly Taxel
    Mar 1 at 14:01













36












36








36


10



$begingroup$


It's my observation.



Let
$$n=p_1×p_2×p_3×dots×p_r$$
where $p_i$ are prime factors and
$f$ and $g$ are the functions
$$f(n)=1+2+dots+n$$
And
$$g(n)=p_1+p_2+dots+p_r$$
If we put $n=21$ then
$$g(f(21))=g(231)=21.$$
I checked it upto $n=10000$, I did not find another number with this property $g(f(n))=n$.



Can we prove that other such numbers do not exist?










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$




It's my observation.



Let
$$n=p_1×p_2×p_3×dots×p_r$$
where $p_i$ are prime factors and
$f$ and $g$ are the functions
$$f(n)=1+2+dots+n$$
And
$$g(n)=p_1+p_2+dots+p_r$$
If we put $n=21$ then
$$g(f(21))=g(231)=21.$$
I checked it upto $n=10000$, I did not find another number with this property $g(f(n))=n$.



Can we prove that other such numbers do not exist?







number-theory elementary-number-theory prime-factorization






share|cite|improve this question















share|cite|improve this question













share|cite|improve this question




share|cite|improve this question








edited Mar 1 at 14:12









Asaf Karagila

307k33439771




307k33439771










asked Mar 1 at 7:15









Pruthviraj HajariPruthviraj Hajari

19517




19517











  • $begingroup$
    To clarify, is $g(12)=5$ or $=7$?
    $endgroup$
    – Hagen von Eitzen
    Mar 1 at 7:22










  • $begingroup$
    12=3*2*2 then g(12)=2+2+3=7
    $endgroup$
    – Pruthviraj Hajari
    Mar 1 at 7:35







  • 2




    $begingroup$
    @PruthvirajHajari Did you come up with this problem by yourself? If so, please state that in your question and include the program code used to run it.
    $endgroup$
    – TheSimpliFire
    Mar 1 at 7:47










  • $begingroup$
    I encourage you to accept my answer by clicking the tick you see beside it.
    $endgroup$
    – Parcly Taxel
    Mar 1 at 13:37






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @PruthvirajHajari sure it is.
    $endgroup$
    – Parcly Taxel
    Mar 1 at 14:01
















  • $begingroup$
    To clarify, is $g(12)=5$ or $=7$?
    $endgroup$
    – Hagen von Eitzen
    Mar 1 at 7:22










  • $begingroup$
    12=3*2*2 then g(12)=2+2+3=7
    $endgroup$
    – Pruthviraj Hajari
    Mar 1 at 7:35







  • 2




    $begingroup$
    @PruthvirajHajari Did you come up with this problem by yourself? If so, please state that in your question and include the program code used to run it.
    $endgroup$
    – TheSimpliFire
    Mar 1 at 7:47










  • $begingroup$
    I encourage you to accept my answer by clicking the tick you see beside it.
    $endgroup$
    – Parcly Taxel
    Mar 1 at 13:37






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @PruthvirajHajari sure it is.
    $endgroup$
    – Parcly Taxel
    Mar 1 at 14:01















$begingroup$
To clarify, is $g(12)=5$ or $=7$?
$endgroup$
– Hagen von Eitzen
Mar 1 at 7:22




$begingroup$
To clarify, is $g(12)=5$ or $=7$?
$endgroup$
– Hagen von Eitzen
Mar 1 at 7:22












$begingroup$
12=3*2*2 then g(12)=2+2+3=7
$endgroup$
– Pruthviraj Hajari
Mar 1 at 7:35





$begingroup$
12=3*2*2 then g(12)=2+2+3=7
$endgroup$
– Pruthviraj Hajari
Mar 1 at 7:35





2




2




$begingroup$
@PruthvirajHajari Did you come up with this problem by yourself? If so, please state that in your question and include the program code used to run it.
$endgroup$
– TheSimpliFire
Mar 1 at 7:47




$begingroup$
@PruthvirajHajari Did you come up with this problem by yourself? If so, please state that in your question and include the program code used to run it.
$endgroup$
– TheSimpliFire
Mar 1 at 7:47












$begingroup$
I encourage you to accept my answer by clicking the tick you see beside it.
$endgroup$
– Parcly Taxel
Mar 1 at 13:37




$begingroup$
I encourage you to accept my answer by clicking the tick you see beside it.
$endgroup$
– Parcly Taxel
Mar 1 at 13:37




1




1




$begingroup$
@PruthvirajHajari sure it is.
$endgroup$
– Parcly Taxel
Mar 1 at 14:01




$begingroup$
@PruthvirajHajari sure it is.
$endgroup$
– Parcly Taxel
Mar 1 at 14:01










1 Answer
1






active

oldest

votes


















49












$begingroup$

This is a very interesting question…



$newcommandsopfroperatornamesopfr$
$f(n)=fracn(n+1)2$ and $g(n)=sopfr(n)$, the sum of prime factors of $n$ with repeats (OEIS A001414). We want $n$ such that $g(f(n))=n$ or
$$sopfrleft(fracn(n+1)2right)=ntag1$$
which can be split into two cases due to the property $sopfr(ab)=sopfr(a)+sopfr(b)$.



  • If $n$ is even, then $sopfrleft(frac n2right)+sopfr(n+1)=n$. We know that $sopfr(n)le n$, so $sopfrleft(frac n2right)lefrac n2$ and consequently $sopfr(n+1)gefrac n2$. Either $n+1$ is a prime, in which case the LHS of $(1)$ is greater than $n$ and so the equality cannot hold, or $n+1$ is odd composite and so has a least prime factor at least 3*, yielding $sopfr(n+1)le3+fracn+13$ and thus
    $$frac n2le3+fracn+13$$
    which is only true for $nle20$. Checking those $n$ reveals no solutions to $(1)$.

  • If $n$ is odd, the reasoning is similar: $sopfrleft(fracn+12right)+sopfr(n)=n$, where $sopfrleft(fracn+12right)lefracn+12$ and so $sopfr(n)gefracn-12$. Since $n$ is odd, either it is prime and the LHS of $(1)$ is greater than $n$, or it has a least prime factor at least 3* and $sopfr(n)le3+frac n3$, giving
    $$fracn-12le3+frac n3$$
    which only holds for $nle21$. 21 is the solution to $(1)$ pointed out in the original question; we have just shown it is the only one.


*Technically we have to repeat the argument for other possible least prime factors $k$ of $n$ or $n+1$ – and the upper bound $N_k$ of the solution to the inequalities in $n$ increases accordingly, each 3 replaced with $k$. However, the least composite number with least prime factor $k$ is $k^2$, and this increases much faster than $N_k$ (which is $simfrac k2$). Indeed, $5^2$ already exceeds $N_5$ for both inequalities.



The method I use above has very strong similarities to the method I used in my most famous answer of all. It is sheer coincidence that 21 is a solution to both the problems I answered.






share|cite|improve this answer











$endgroup$








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    To elaborate on the footnote: If $n$ is composite and $p$ its minimal prime factor, then $operatornamesopfr(n)=p+operatornamesopfr(n/p)le p+frac np$ and $xmapsto x+frac nx$ is a decreasing function on $(0,sqrt n)$, hence $n$ odd and composite implies $operatornamesopfr(n)le 3+frac n3$.
    $endgroup$
    – Hagen von Eitzen
    Mar 1 at 15:47











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1 Answer
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1 Answer
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active

oldest

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active

oldest

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active

oldest

votes









49












$begingroup$

This is a very interesting question…



$newcommandsopfroperatornamesopfr$
$f(n)=fracn(n+1)2$ and $g(n)=sopfr(n)$, the sum of prime factors of $n$ with repeats (OEIS A001414). We want $n$ such that $g(f(n))=n$ or
$$sopfrleft(fracn(n+1)2right)=ntag1$$
which can be split into two cases due to the property $sopfr(ab)=sopfr(a)+sopfr(b)$.



  • If $n$ is even, then $sopfrleft(frac n2right)+sopfr(n+1)=n$. We know that $sopfr(n)le n$, so $sopfrleft(frac n2right)lefrac n2$ and consequently $sopfr(n+1)gefrac n2$. Either $n+1$ is a prime, in which case the LHS of $(1)$ is greater than $n$ and so the equality cannot hold, or $n+1$ is odd composite and so has a least prime factor at least 3*, yielding $sopfr(n+1)le3+fracn+13$ and thus
    $$frac n2le3+fracn+13$$
    which is only true for $nle20$. Checking those $n$ reveals no solutions to $(1)$.

  • If $n$ is odd, the reasoning is similar: $sopfrleft(fracn+12right)+sopfr(n)=n$, where $sopfrleft(fracn+12right)lefracn+12$ and so $sopfr(n)gefracn-12$. Since $n$ is odd, either it is prime and the LHS of $(1)$ is greater than $n$, or it has a least prime factor at least 3* and $sopfr(n)le3+frac n3$, giving
    $$fracn-12le3+frac n3$$
    which only holds for $nle21$. 21 is the solution to $(1)$ pointed out in the original question; we have just shown it is the only one.


*Technically we have to repeat the argument for other possible least prime factors $k$ of $n$ or $n+1$ – and the upper bound $N_k$ of the solution to the inequalities in $n$ increases accordingly, each 3 replaced with $k$. However, the least composite number with least prime factor $k$ is $k^2$, and this increases much faster than $N_k$ (which is $simfrac k2$). Indeed, $5^2$ already exceeds $N_5$ for both inequalities.



The method I use above has very strong similarities to the method I used in my most famous answer of all. It is sheer coincidence that 21 is a solution to both the problems I answered.






share|cite|improve this answer











$endgroup$








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    To elaborate on the footnote: If $n$ is composite and $p$ its minimal prime factor, then $operatornamesopfr(n)=p+operatornamesopfr(n/p)le p+frac np$ and $xmapsto x+frac nx$ is a decreasing function on $(0,sqrt n)$, hence $n$ odd and composite implies $operatornamesopfr(n)le 3+frac n3$.
    $endgroup$
    – Hagen von Eitzen
    Mar 1 at 15:47















49












$begingroup$

This is a very interesting question…



$newcommandsopfroperatornamesopfr$
$f(n)=fracn(n+1)2$ and $g(n)=sopfr(n)$, the sum of prime factors of $n$ with repeats (OEIS A001414). We want $n$ such that $g(f(n))=n$ or
$$sopfrleft(fracn(n+1)2right)=ntag1$$
which can be split into two cases due to the property $sopfr(ab)=sopfr(a)+sopfr(b)$.



  • If $n$ is even, then $sopfrleft(frac n2right)+sopfr(n+1)=n$. We know that $sopfr(n)le n$, so $sopfrleft(frac n2right)lefrac n2$ and consequently $sopfr(n+1)gefrac n2$. Either $n+1$ is a prime, in which case the LHS of $(1)$ is greater than $n$ and so the equality cannot hold, or $n+1$ is odd composite and so has a least prime factor at least 3*, yielding $sopfr(n+1)le3+fracn+13$ and thus
    $$frac n2le3+fracn+13$$
    which is only true for $nle20$. Checking those $n$ reveals no solutions to $(1)$.

  • If $n$ is odd, the reasoning is similar: $sopfrleft(fracn+12right)+sopfr(n)=n$, where $sopfrleft(fracn+12right)lefracn+12$ and so $sopfr(n)gefracn-12$. Since $n$ is odd, either it is prime and the LHS of $(1)$ is greater than $n$, or it has a least prime factor at least 3* and $sopfr(n)le3+frac n3$, giving
    $$fracn-12le3+frac n3$$
    which only holds for $nle21$. 21 is the solution to $(1)$ pointed out in the original question; we have just shown it is the only one.


*Technically we have to repeat the argument for other possible least prime factors $k$ of $n$ or $n+1$ – and the upper bound $N_k$ of the solution to the inequalities in $n$ increases accordingly, each 3 replaced with $k$. However, the least composite number with least prime factor $k$ is $k^2$, and this increases much faster than $N_k$ (which is $simfrac k2$). Indeed, $5^2$ already exceeds $N_5$ for both inequalities.



The method I use above has very strong similarities to the method I used in my most famous answer of all. It is sheer coincidence that 21 is a solution to both the problems I answered.






share|cite|improve this answer











$endgroup$








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    To elaborate on the footnote: If $n$ is composite and $p$ its minimal prime factor, then $operatornamesopfr(n)=p+operatornamesopfr(n/p)le p+frac np$ and $xmapsto x+frac nx$ is a decreasing function on $(0,sqrt n)$, hence $n$ odd and composite implies $operatornamesopfr(n)le 3+frac n3$.
    $endgroup$
    – Hagen von Eitzen
    Mar 1 at 15:47













49












49








49





$begingroup$

This is a very interesting question…



$newcommandsopfroperatornamesopfr$
$f(n)=fracn(n+1)2$ and $g(n)=sopfr(n)$, the sum of prime factors of $n$ with repeats (OEIS A001414). We want $n$ such that $g(f(n))=n$ or
$$sopfrleft(fracn(n+1)2right)=ntag1$$
which can be split into two cases due to the property $sopfr(ab)=sopfr(a)+sopfr(b)$.



  • If $n$ is even, then $sopfrleft(frac n2right)+sopfr(n+1)=n$. We know that $sopfr(n)le n$, so $sopfrleft(frac n2right)lefrac n2$ and consequently $sopfr(n+1)gefrac n2$. Either $n+1$ is a prime, in which case the LHS of $(1)$ is greater than $n$ and so the equality cannot hold, or $n+1$ is odd composite and so has a least prime factor at least 3*, yielding $sopfr(n+1)le3+fracn+13$ and thus
    $$frac n2le3+fracn+13$$
    which is only true for $nle20$. Checking those $n$ reveals no solutions to $(1)$.

  • If $n$ is odd, the reasoning is similar: $sopfrleft(fracn+12right)+sopfr(n)=n$, where $sopfrleft(fracn+12right)lefracn+12$ and so $sopfr(n)gefracn-12$. Since $n$ is odd, either it is prime and the LHS of $(1)$ is greater than $n$, or it has a least prime factor at least 3* and $sopfr(n)le3+frac n3$, giving
    $$fracn-12le3+frac n3$$
    which only holds for $nle21$. 21 is the solution to $(1)$ pointed out in the original question; we have just shown it is the only one.


*Technically we have to repeat the argument for other possible least prime factors $k$ of $n$ or $n+1$ – and the upper bound $N_k$ of the solution to the inequalities in $n$ increases accordingly, each 3 replaced with $k$. However, the least composite number with least prime factor $k$ is $k^2$, and this increases much faster than $N_k$ (which is $simfrac k2$). Indeed, $5^2$ already exceeds $N_5$ for both inequalities.



The method I use above has very strong similarities to the method I used in my most famous answer of all. It is sheer coincidence that 21 is a solution to both the problems I answered.






share|cite|improve this answer











$endgroup$



This is a very interesting question…



$newcommandsopfroperatornamesopfr$
$f(n)=fracn(n+1)2$ and $g(n)=sopfr(n)$, the sum of prime factors of $n$ with repeats (OEIS A001414). We want $n$ such that $g(f(n))=n$ or
$$sopfrleft(fracn(n+1)2right)=ntag1$$
which can be split into two cases due to the property $sopfr(ab)=sopfr(a)+sopfr(b)$.



  • If $n$ is even, then $sopfrleft(frac n2right)+sopfr(n+1)=n$. We know that $sopfr(n)le n$, so $sopfrleft(frac n2right)lefrac n2$ and consequently $sopfr(n+1)gefrac n2$. Either $n+1$ is a prime, in which case the LHS of $(1)$ is greater than $n$ and so the equality cannot hold, or $n+1$ is odd composite and so has a least prime factor at least 3*, yielding $sopfr(n+1)le3+fracn+13$ and thus
    $$frac n2le3+fracn+13$$
    which is only true for $nle20$. Checking those $n$ reveals no solutions to $(1)$.

  • If $n$ is odd, the reasoning is similar: $sopfrleft(fracn+12right)+sopfr(n)=n$, where $sopfrleft(fracn+12right)lefracn+12$ and so $sopfr(n)gefracn-12$. Since $n$ is odd, either it is prime and the LHS of $(1)$ is greater than $n$, or it has a least prime factor at least 3* and $sopfr(n)le3+frac n3$, giving
    $$fracn-12le3+frac n3$$
    which only holds for $nle21$. 21 is the solution to $(1)$ pointed out in the original question; we have just shown it is the only one.


*Technically we have to repeat the argument for other possible least prime factors $k$ of $n$ or $n+1$ – and the upper bound $N_k$ of the solution to the inequalities in $n$ increases accordingly, each 3 replaced with $k$. However, the least composite number with least prime factor $k$ is $k^2$, and this increases much faster than $N_k$ (which is $simfrac k2$). Indeed, $5^2$ already exceeds $N_5$ for both inequalities.



The method I use above has very strong similarities to the method I used in my most famous answer of all. It is sheer coincidence that 21 is a solution to both the problems I answered.







share|cite|improve this answer














share|cite|improve this answer



share|cite|improve this answer








edited Mar 1 at 8:48

























answered Mar 1 at 8:13









Parcly TaxelParcly Taxel

44.7k1376110




44.7k1376110







  • 1




    $begingroup$
    To elaborate on the footnote: If $n$ is composite and $p$ its minimal prime factor, then $operatornamesopfr(n)=p+operatornamesopfr(n/p)le p+frac np$ and $xmapsto x+frac nx$ is a decreasing function on $(0,sqrt n)$, hence $n$ odd and composite implies $operatornamesopfr(n)le 3+frac n3$.
    $endgroup$
    – Hagen von Eitzen
    Mar 1 at 15:47












  • 1




    $begingroup$
    To elaborate on the footnote: If $n$ is composite and $p$ its minimal prime factor, then $operatornamesopfr(n)=p+operatornamesopfr(n/p)le p+frac np$ and $xmapsto x+frac nx$ is a decreasing function on $(0,sqrt n)$, hence $n$ odd and composite implies $operatornamesopfr(n)le 3+frac n3$.
    $endgroup$
    – Hagen von Eitzen
    Mar 1 at 15:47







1




1




$begingroup$
To elaborate on the footnote: If $n$ is composite and $p$ its minimal prime factor, then $operatornamesopfr(n)=p+operatornamesopfr(n/p)le p+frac np$ and $xmapsto x+frac nx$ is a decreasing function on $(0,sqrt n)$, hence $n$ odd and composite implies $operatornamesopfr(n)le 3+frac n3$.
$endgroup$
– Hagen von Eitzen
Mar 1 at 15:47




$begingroup$
To elaborate on the footnote: If $n$ is composite and $p$ its minimal prime factor, then $operatornamesopfr(n)=p+operatornamesopfr(n/p)le p+frac np$ and $xmapsto x+frac nx$ is a decreasing function on $(0,sqrt n)$, hence $n$ odd and composite implies $operatornamesopfr(n)le 3+frac n3$.
$endgroup$
– Hagen von Eitzen
Mar 1 at 15:47

















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