Is there a way to detect an NPC's class without them knowing that I'm detecting it?
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The description of the detect thoughts spell says that when attempting to probe deeper into a target's mind (which I assume would be required to detect their class):
the target knows that you are probing into its mind
I want to know to whether there is any way at all to determine an NPC's class without them knowing in 5e, e.g. by adding other effects from spells or magic items, or by a different tactic entirely.
I would be OK with answers that have limits such as detecting some classes but not all.
dnd-5e npc class
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up vote
2
down vote
favorite
The description of the detect thoughts spell says that when attempting to probe deeper into a target's mind (which I assume would be required to detect their class):
the target knows that you are probing into its mind
I want to know to whether there is any way at all to determine an NPC's class without them knowing in 5e, e.g. by adding other effects from spells or magic items, or by a different tactic entirely.
I would be OK with answers that have limits such as detecting some classes but not all.
dnd-5e npc class
New contributor
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
favorite
up vote
2
down vote
favorite
The description of the detect thoughts spell says that when attempting to probe deeper into a target's mind (which I assume would be required to detect their class):
the target knows that you are probing into its mind
I want to know to whether there is any way at all to determine an NPC's class without them knowing in 5e, e.g. by adding other effects from spells or magic items, or by a different tactic entirely.
I would be OK with answers that have limits such as detecting some classes but not all.
dnd-5e npc class
New contributor
The description of the detect thoughts spell says that when attempting to probe deeper into a target's mind (which I assume would be required to detect their class):
the target knows that you are probing into its mind
I want to know to whether there is any way at all to determine an NPC's class without them knowing in 5e, e.g. by adding other effects from spells or magic items, or by a different tactic entirely.
I would be OK with answers that have limits such as detecting some classes but not all.
dnd-5e npc class
dnd-5e npc class
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edited 2 hours ago
V2Blast
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BigJamey
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3 Answers
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active
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up vote
4
down vote
There are no rules that would explicitly provide a way to do this, because D&D doesnâÂÂt want to make a stand on whether or not classes are things that characters are aware of and know themselves. Some thingsâÂÂpaladin oaths, warlock patrons, etc.âÂÂare pretty explicit and obvious, but others, particularly fighter and rogue are very generic and can lend themselves to a wide variety of characters, occupations, and fighting styles. There is no particular reason why they would necessarily see any commonality between them.
Which therefore means that class may not be a thing to know. That may, depending on your campaign, be purely metagame information. ItâÂÂs entirely plausible, in fact, that even things like oaths and pacts are not as neat and consistent as laid out in the books, but rather more unique to the individuals involved. It is very reasonable for, say, a sorcerer/warlock to say that all of their power comes from the patron, just that itâÂÂs a different sort of pact than a pure warlock has. And so on and so forth.
Since D&D doesnâÂÂt want to dictate how any given table handles this, they cannot write mechanics that rely on it being âÂÂrealâ in-character information, so no such detection spell could be written.1 If classes are real, known concepts within your campaign, you will have to ask your DM for details on how you can know and recognize them in character.
- This applies to a lot of things in D&D, and always has, though 5e is arguably trying to go farther with it than other editions. However, they arenâÂÂt doing so perfectlyâÂÂwhile they often say they support a variety of playstyles, they sometimes seem to forget that and write mechanics that presuppose one particular style. But this is one particular case where they havenâÂÂt done that, and personally I suspect they wonâÂÂt.
Your footnote is pregnant with meaning -- don't want to push this thread off-topic but would love to see more clarification about how to "support a variety of playstyles".
â BigJamey
47 mins ago
@BigJamey ItâÂÂs nothing earth-shattering, they just havenâÂÂt always backed up claims that different styles are equally-valid with their mechanics. For examples, search here for the Q&As on whether or not DMs should roll in the open, and on whether or not spells can do more than they say they do. Both are issues where Wizards of the Coast officially has suggested that 5e is flexible on and can be chosen by the table, but then have written mechanics or commentary that are, at best, extremely awkward unless you follow one particular style.
â KRyan
16 mins ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
Generally no, but sometimes you could get partial knowledge of this
Only because the OP said it would be open to limited solutions, we could consider using Detect Magic
you can use your action to see a faint aura around any visible creature or object in the area that bears magic, and you learn its school of magic, if any
So depending on whether your DM rules that a spellcaster counts as a "creature.... that bears magic", you would know that they are a spellcaster, though in 5e this doesn't narrow down class very much, considering things like Arcane Trickster and Eldridge Knight.
Furthermore, almost all wizards have an Arcane Tradition that dedicates them to one school of magic, so it could be argued if they are a wizard, you would pick up their school, and since no other classes have a school, you could infer they are probably a wizard.
(Your DM might however rule that a person does not "bear magic", even when they are a spellcaster, unless they are actively concentrating on a spell. Their magic doesn't "come out" otherwise.)
Finally, via the same spell, you might detect a magic item in the person's possession, and then if through role-playing you could get enough observation of it to make a successful Arcana check, then you might know if it requires attunement by a certain class, and again could infer (though not with certainty) something about that person's class.
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
Battle Master Fighters know (some of) this information
The Battle Master Fighters gain the following feature at level 7 (PHB, p. 73-74, bold added):
Know Your Enemy
Starting at 7th level, if you spend at least 1 minute observing or
interacting with another creature outside combat, you can learn
certain information about its capabilities compared to your own. The
DM tells you if the creature is your equal, superior, or inferior in
regard to two of the following characteristics of your choice:
- Strength score
- Dexterity score
- Constitution score
- Armor Class
- Current hit points
- Total class levels (if any)
- Fighter class levels (if any)
So you could discover if the NPC had class levels and fighter levels: this isn't foolproof. If they have none, you might be told "fewer" by the DM and not given more information. But if they have as many or more class levels or fighter levels than you, you'll definitely discover that.
add a comment |Â
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
4
down vote
There are no rules that would explicitly provide a way to do this, because D&D doesnâÂÂt want to make a stand on whether or not classes are things that characters are aware of and know themselves. Some thingsâÂÂpaladin oaths, warlock patrons, etc.âÂÂare pretty explicit and obvious, but others, particularly fighter and rogue are very generic and can lend themselves to a wide variety of characters, occupations, and fighting styles. There is no particular reason why they would necessarily see any commonality between them.
Which therefore means that class may not be a thing to know. That may, depending on your campaign, be purely metagame information. ItâÂÂs entirely plausible, in fact, that even things like oaths and pacts are not as neat and consistent as laid out in the books, but rather more unique to the individuals involved. It is very reasonable for, say, a sorcerer/warlock to say that all of their power comes from the patron, just that itâÂÂs a different sort of pact than a pure warlock has. And so on and so forth.
Since D&D doesnâÂÂt want to dictate how any given table handles this, they cannot write mechanics that rely on it being âÂÂrealâ in-character information, so no such detection spell could be written.1 If classes are real, known concepts within your campaign, you will have to ask your DM for details on how you can know and recognize them in character.
- This applies to a lot of things in D&D, and always has, though 5e is arguably trying to go farther with it than other editions. However, they arenâÂÂt doing so perfectlyâÂÂwhile they often say they support a variety of playstyles, they sometimes seem to forget that and write mechanics that presuppose one particular style. But this is one particular case where they havenâÂÂt done that, and personally I suspect they wonâÂÂt.
Your footnote is pregnant with meaning -- don't want to push this thread off-topic but would love to see more clarification about how to "support a variety of playstyles".
â BigJamey
47 mins ago
@BigJamey ItâÂÂs nothing earth-shattering, they just havenâÂÂt always backed up claims that different styles are equally-valid with their mechanics. For examples, search here for the Q&As on whether or not DMs should roll in the open, and on whether or not spells can do more than they say they do. Both are issues where Wizards of the Coast officially has suggested that 5e is flexible on and can be chosen by the table, but then have written mechanics or commentary that are, at best, extremely awkward unless you follow one particular style.
â KRyan
16 mins ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
4
down vote
There are no rules that would explicitly provide a way to do this, because D&D doesnâÂÂt want to make a stand on whether or not classes are things that characters are aware of and know themselves. Some thingsâÂÂpaladin oaths, warlock patrons, etc.âÂÂare pretty explicit and obvious, but others, particularly fighter and rogue are very generic and can lend themselves to a wide variety of characters, occupations, and fighting styles. There is no particular reason why they would necessarily see any commonality between them.
Which therefore means that class may not be a thing to know. That may, depending on your campaign, be purely metagame information. ItâÂÂs entirely plausible, in fact, that even things like oaths and pacts are not as neat and consistent as laid out in the books, but rather more unique to the individuals involved. It is very reasonable for, say, a sorcerer/warlock to say that all of their power comes from the patron, just that itâÂÂs a different sort of pact than a pure warlock has. And so on and so forth.
Since D&D doesnâÂÂt want to dictate how any given table handles this, they cannot write mechanics that rely on it being âÂÂrealâ in-character information, so no such detection spell could be written.1 If classes are real, known concepts within your campaign, you will have to ask your DM for details on how you can know and recognize them in character.
- This applies to a lot of things in D&D, and always has, though 5e is arguably trying to go farther with it than other editions. However, they arenâÂÂt doing so perfectlyâÂÂwhile they often say they support a variety of playstyles, they sometimes seem to forget that and write mechanics that presuppose one particular style. But this is one particular case where they havenâÂÂt done that, and personally I suspect they wonâÂÂt.
Your footnote is pregnant with meaning -- don't want to push this thread off-topic but would love to see more clarification about how to "support a variety of playstyles".
â BigJamey
47 mins ago
@BigJamey ItâÂÂs nothing earth-shattering, they just havenâÂÂt always backed up claims that different styles are equally-valid with their mechanics. For examples, search here for the Q&As on whether or not DMs should roll in the open, and on whether or not spells can do more than they say they do. Both are issues where Wizards of the Coast officially has suggested that 5e is flexible on and can be chosen by the table, but then have written mechanics or commentary that are, at best, extremely awkward unless you follow one particular style.
â KRyan
16 mins ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
4
down vote
up vote
4
down vote
There are no rules that would explicitly provide a way to do this, because D&D doesnâÂÂt want to make a stand on whether or not classes are things that characters are aware of and know themselves. Some thingsâÂÂpaladin oaths, warlock patrons, etc.âÂÂare pretty explicit and obvious, but others, particularly fighter and rogue are very generic and can lend themselves to a wide variety of characters, occupations, and fighting styles. There is no particular reason why they would necessarily see any commonality between them.
Which therefore means that class may not be a thing to know. That may, depending on your campaign, be purely metagame information. ItâÂÂs entirely plausible, in fact, that even things like oaths and pacts are not as neat and consistent as laid out in the books, but rather more unique to the individuals involved. It is very reasonable for, say, a sorcerer/warlock to say that all of their power comes from the patron, just that itâÂÂs a different sort of pact than a pure warlock has. And so on and so forth.
Since D&D doesnâÂÂt want to dictate how any given table handles this, they cannot write mechanics that rely on it being âÂÂrealâ in-character information, so no such detection spell could be written.1 If classes are real, known concepts within your campaign, you will have to ask your DM for details on how you can know and recognize them in character.
- This applies to a lot of things in D&D, and always has, though 5e is arguably trying to go farther with it than other editions. However, they arenâÂÂt doing so perfectlyâÂÂwhile they often say they support a variety of playstyles, they sometimes seem to forget that and write mechanics that presuppose one particular style. But this is one particular case where they havenâÂÂt done that, and personally I suspect they wonâÂÂt.
There are no rules that would explicitly provide a way to do this, because D&D doesnâÂÂt want to make a stand on whether or not classes are things that characters are aware of and know themselves. Some thingsâÂÂpaladin oaths, warlock patrons, etc.âÂÂare pretty explicit and obvious, but others, particularly fighter and rogue are very generic and can lend themselves to a wide variety of characters, occupations, and fighting styles. There is no particular reason why they would necessarily see any commonality between them.
Which therefore means that class may not be a thing to know. That may, depending on your campaign, be purely metagame information. ItâÂÂs entirely plausible, in fact, that even things like oaths and pacts are not as neat and consistent as laid out in the books, but rather more unique to the individuals involved. It is very reasonable for, say, a sorcerer/warlock to say that all of their power comes from the patron, just that itâÂÂs a different sort of pact than a pure warlock has. And so on and so forth.
Since D&D doesnâÂÂt want to dictate how any given table handles this, they cannot write mechanics that rely on it being âÂÂrealâ in-character information, so no such detection spell could be written.1 If classes are real, known concepts within your campaign, you will have to ask your DM for details on how you can know and recognize them in character.
- This applies to a lot of things in D&D, and always has, though 5e is arguably trying to go farther with it than other editions. However, they arenâÂÂt doing so perfectlyâÂÂwhile they often say they support a variety of playstyles, they sometimes seem to forget that and write mechanics that presuppose one particular style. But this is one particular case where they havenâÂÂt done that, and personally I suspect they wonâÂÂt.
edited 1 hour ago
answered 1 hour ago
KRyan
211k26527913
211k26527913
Your footnote is pregnant with meaning -- don't want to push this thread off-topic but would love to see more clarification about how to "support a variety of playstyles".
â BigJamey
47 mins ago
@BigJamey ItâÂÂs nothing earth-shattering, they just havenâÂÂt always backed up claims that different styles are equally-valid with their mechanics. For examples, search here for the Q&As on whether or not DMs should roll in the open, and on whether or not spells can do more than they say they do. Both are issues where Wizards of the Coast officially has suggested that 5e is flexible on and can be chosen by the table, but then have written mechanics or commentary that are, at best, extremely awkward unless you follow one particular style.
â KRyan
16 mins ago
add a comment |Â
Your footnote is pregnant with meaning -- don't want to push this thread off-topic but would love to see more clarification about how to "support a variety of playstyles".
â BigJamey
47 mins ago
@BigJamey ItâÂÂs nothing earth-shattering, they just havenâÂÂt always backed up claims that different styles are equally-valid with their mechanics. For examples, search here for the Q&As on whether or not DMs should roll in the open, and on whether or not spells can do more than they say they do. Both are issues where Wizards of the Coast officially has suggested that 5e is flexible on and can be chosen by the table, but then have written mechanics or commentary that are, at best, extremely awkward unless you follow one particular style.
â KRyan
16 mins ago
Your footnote is pregnant with meaning -- don't want to push this thread off-topic but would love to see more clarification about how to "support a variety of playstyles".
â BigJamey
47 mins ago
Your footnote is pregnant with meaning -- don't want to push this thread off-topic but would love to see more clarification about how to "support a variety of playstyles".
â BigJamey
47 mins ago
@BigJamey ItâÂÂs nothing earth-shattering, they just havenâÂÂt always backed up claims that different styles are equally-valid with their mechanics. For examples, search here for the Q&As on whether or not DMs should roll in the open, and on whether or not spells can do more than they say they do. Both are issues where Wizards of the Coast officially has suggested that 5e is flexible on and can be chosen by the table, but then have written mechanics or commentary that are, at best, extremely awkward unless you follow one particular style.
â KRyan
16 mins ago
@BigJamey ItâÂÂs nothing earth-shattering, they just havenâÂÂt always backed up claims that different styles are equally-valid with their mechanics. For examples, search here for the Q&As on whether or not DMs should roll in the open, and on whether or not spells can do more than they say they do. Both are issues where Wizards of the Coast officially has suggested that 5e is flexible on and can be chosen by the table, but then have written mechanics or commentary that are, at best, extremely awkward unless you follow one particular style.
â KRyan
16 mins ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
Generally no, but sometimes you could get partial knowledge of this
Only because the OP said it would be open to limited solutions, we could consider using Detect Magic
you can use your action to see a faint aura around any visible creature or object in the area that bears magic, and you learn its school of magic, if any
So depending on whether your DM rules that a spellcaster counts as a "creature.... that bears magic", you would know that they are a spellcaster, though in 5e this doesn't narrow down class very much, considering things like Arcane Trickster and Eldridge Knight.
Furthermore, almost all wizards have an Arcane Tradition that dedicates them to one school of magic, so it could be argued if they are a wizard, you would pick up their school, and since no other classes have a school, you could infer they are probably a wizard.
(Your DM might however rule that a person does not "bear magic", even when they are a spellcaster, unless they are actively concentrating on a spell. Their magic doesn't "come out" otherwise.)
Finally, via the same spell, you might detect a magic item in the person's possession, and then if through role-playing you could get enough observation of it to make a successful Arcana check, then you might know if it requires attunement by a certain class, and again could infer (though not with certainty) something about that person's class.
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
Generally no, but sometimes you could get partial knowledge of this
Only because the OP said it would be open to limited solutions, we could consider using Detect Magic
you can use your action to see a faint aura around any visible creature or object in the area that bears magic, and you learn its school of magic, if any
So depending on whether your DM rules that a spellcaster counts as a "creature.... that bears magic", you would know that they are a spellcaster, though in 5e this doesn't narrow down class very much, considering things like Arcane Trickster and Eldridge Knight.
Furthermore, almost all wizards have an Arcane Tradition that dedicates them to one school of magic, so it could be argued if they are a wizard, you would pick up their school, and since no other classes have a school, you could infer they are probably a wizard.
(Your DM might however rule that a person does not "bear magic", even when they are a spellcaster, unless they are actively concentrating on a spell. Their magic doesn't "come out" otherwise.)
Finally, via the same spell, you might detect a magic item in the person's possession, and then if through role-playing you could get enough observation of it to make a successful Arcana check, then you might know if it requires attunement by a certain class, and again could infer (though not with certainty) something about that person's class.
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
up vote
0
down vote
Generally no, but sometimes you could get partial knowledge of this
Only because the OP said it would be open to limited solutions, we could consider using Detect Magic
you can use your action to see a faint aura around any visible creature or object in the area that bears magic, and you learn its school of magic, if any
So depending on whether your DM rules that a spellcaster counts as a "creature.... that bears magic", you would know that they are a spellcaster, though in 5e this doesn't narrow down class very much, considering things like Arcane Trickster and Eldridge Knight.
Furthermore, almost all wizards have an Arcane Tradition that dedicates them to one school of magic, so it could be argued if they are a wizard, you would pick up their school, and since no other classes have a school, you could infer they are probably a wizard.
(Your DM might however rule that a person does not "bear magic", even when they are a spellcaster, unless they are actively concentrating on a spell. Their magic doesn't "come out" otherwise.)
Finally, via the same spell, you might detect a magic item in the person's possession, and then if through role-playing you could get enough observation of it to make a successful Arcana check, then you might know if it requires attunement by a certain class, and again could infer (though not with certainty) something about that person's class.
Generally no, but sometimes you could get partial knowledge of this
Only because the OP said it would be open to limited solutions, we could consider using Detect Magic
you can use your action to see a faint aura around any visible creature or object in the area that bears magic, and you learn its school of magic, if any
So depending on whether your DM rules that a spellcaster counts as a "creature.... that bears magic", you would know that they are a spellcaster, though in 5e this doesn't narrow down class very much, considering things like Arcane Trickster and Eldridge Knight.
Furthermore, almost all wizards have an Arcane Tradition that dedicates them to one school of magic, so it could be argued if they are a wizard, you would pick up their school, and since no other classes have a school, you could infer they are probably a wizard.
(Your DM might however rule that a person does not "bear magic", even when they are a spellcaster, unless they are actively concentrating on a spell. Their magic doesn't "come out" otherwise.)
Finally, via the same spell, you might detect a magic item in the person's possession, and then if through role-playing you could get enough observation of it to make a successful Arcana check, then you might know if it requires attunement by a certain class, and again could infer (though not with certainty) something about that person's class.
answered 1 hour ago
Valley Lad
935
935
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up vote
0
down vote
Battle Master Fighters know (some of) this information
The Battle Master Fighters gain the following feature at level 7 (PHB, p. 73-74, bold added):
Know Your Enemy
Starting at 7th level, if you spend at least 1 minute observing or
interacting with another creature outside combat, you can learn
certain information about its capabilities compared to your own. The
DM tells you if the creature is your equal, superior, or inferior in
regard to two of the following characteristics of your choice:
- Strength score
- Dexterity score
- Constitution score
- Armor Class
- Current hit points
- Total class levels (if any)
- Fighter class levels (if any)
So you could discover if the NPC had class levels and fighter levels: this isn't foolproof. If they have none, you might be told "fewer" by the DM and not given more information. But if they have as many or more class levels or fighter levels than you, you'll definitely discover that.
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
Battle Master Fighters know (some of) this information
The Battle Master Fighters gain the following feature at level 7 (PHB, p. 73-74, bold added):
Know Your Enemy
Starting at 7th level, if you spend at least 1 minute observing or
interacting with another creature outside combat, you can learn
certain information about its capabilities compared to your own. The
DM tells you if the creature is your equal, superior, or inferior in
regard to two of the following characteristics of your choice:
- Strength score
- Dexterity score
- Constitution score
- Armor Class
- Current hit points
- Total class levels (if any)
- Fighter class levels (if any)
So you could discover if the NPC had class levels and fighter levels: this isn't foolproof. If they have none, you might be told "fewer" by the DM and not given more information. But if they have as many or more class levels or fighter levels than you, you'll definitely discover that.
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
up vote
0
down vote
Battle Master Fighters know (some of) this information
The Battle Master Fighters gain the following feature at level 7 (PHB, p. 73-74, bold added):
Know Your Enemy
Starting at 7th level, if you spend at least 1 minute observing or
interacting with another creature outside combat, you can learn
certain information about its capabilities compared to your own. The
DM tells you if the creature is your equal, superior, or inferior in
regard to two of the following characteristics of your choice:
- Strength score
- Dexterity score
- Constitution score
- Armor Class
- Current hit points
- Total class levels (if any)
- Fighter class levels (if any)
So you could discover if the NPC had class levels and fighter levels: this isn't foolproof. If they have none, you might be told "fewer" by the DM and not given more information. But if they have as many or more class levels or fighter levels than you, you'll definitely discover that.
Battle Master Fighters know (some of) this information
The Battle Master Fighters gain the following feature at level 7 (PHB, p. 73-74, bold added):
Know Your Enemy
Starting at 7th level, if you spend at least 1 minute observing or
interacting with another creature outside combat, you can learn
certain information about its capabilities compared to your own. The
DM tells you if the creature is your equal, superior, or inferior in
regard to two of the following characteristics of your choice:
- Strength score
- Dexterity score
- Constitution score
- Armor Class
- Current hit points
- Total class levels (if any)
- Fighter class levels (if any)
So you could discover if the NPC had class levels and fighter levels: this isn't foolproof. If they have none, you might be told "fewer" by the DM and not given more information. But if they have as many or more class levels or fighter levels than you, you'll definitely discover that.
answered 59 mins ago
Gandalfmeansme
15.2k25699
15.2k25699
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
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